Backdoor "References" - RecruitingBlogs2024-03-29T08:48:55Zhttps://recruitingblogs.com/forum/topics/backdoor-references?commentId=502551%3AComment%3A1193552&feed=yes&xn_auth=noI like it Terry!
...One of…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-11:502551:Comment:11949822011-05-11T19:06:00.517ZChaserhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/Chaser
<p>I like it Terry!</p>
<p> </p>
<p>...One of those "Why didnt I think of that?" moments for me.</p>
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<p>I will be sure to use this tactic next time this hurdle gets in my way. Because going back at em' a third time with this analogy is a little late obviously. Really apprecaite your advice though, thank you sir!</p>
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<p>-Chase</p>
<p>I like it Terry!</p>
<p> </p>
<p>...One of those "Why didnt I think of that?" moments for me.</p>
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<p>I will be sure to use this tactic next time this hurdle gets in my way. Because going back at em' a third time with this analogy is a little late obviously. Really apprecaite your advice though, thank you sir!</p>
<p> </p>
<p>-Chase</p> I would explain to my client…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-11:502551:Comment:11953042011-05-11T18:52:30.647ZTerry Correllhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/TerryCorrell
I would explain to my client that he should us the feedback from his reference as part of his decision making criteria but that he needs to do his own due diligence and make an informed decision. Explain that we have this same conversation on the candidate side, there may be a candidate who would be "perfect" for his role but the candidate heard some negative feedback on the client. We encourage the candidate to gather his own data points and then add that to the feedback they received and…
I would explain to my client that he should us the feedback from his reference as part of his decision making criteria but that he needs to do his own due diligence and make an informed decision. Explain that we have this same conversation on the candidate side, there may be a candidate who would be "perfect" for his role but the candidate heard some negative feedback on the client. We encourage the candidate to gather his own data points and then add that to the feedback they received and make an informed decision. Love the string of comments a…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-10:502551:Comment:11943072011-05-10T02:12:49.753ZTim Moorehttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/TimMoore
Love the string of comments about this insightful topic. My immediate reaction was 'get references' too, but I recall that we ALSO had experienced the 'roll up the sleeves' type of role 'barrier.' So, apart from our 'regular' set of reference questions, we have an augmented set for "Senior Manager" types, which includes other questions...but one in particular asks references to describe our candidate being:<br />
<p class="t8"><b>Self Reliant:</b> Able to “roll up their sleeves” and put in a…</p>
Love the string of comments about this insightful topic. My immediate reaction was 'get references' too, but I recall that we ALSO had experienced the 'roll up the sleeves' type of role 'barrier.' So, apart from our 'regular' set of reference questions, we have an augmented set for "Senior Manager" types, which includes other questions...but one in particular asks references to describe our candidate being:<br />
<p class="t8"><b>Self Reliant:</b> Able to “roll up their sleeves” and put in a concerted effort and obtain results, even if it means spearheading and working on a major project(s); with absolutely little or no support.</p>
<p class="t8">This has helped out on more than one occassion. Then it becomes: "Hey, don't take my word for it, look what his/her references had to say about that..."</p>
<p class="t8"> </p>
<p class="t8">Good luck.</p>
<p class="t8">Tim Moore</p> I am a believer of "things ha…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-09:502551:Comment:11937862011-05-09T20:58:03.615ZChaserhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/Chaser
<p>I am a believer of "things happen for reasons"...So as I walk away from this I'm left chuckling inside...</p>
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<p>Thank you guys for all your input and we'll talk soon! </p>
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<p>Enjoy your week Recruiters!</p>
<p> </p>
<p>-C</p>
<p>I am a believer of "things happen for reasons"...So as I walk away from this I'm left chuckling inside...</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Thank you guys for all your input and we'll talk soon! </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Enjoy your week Recruiters!</p>
<p> </p>
<p>-C</p> When things like this happen…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-09:502551:Comment:11941252011-05-09T20:40:15.421ZLisa J. Greenhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/LisaG
<p>When things like this happen it's so disheartning, but I do believe everything happens for a reason. I've seen it time and time again...just like Mat's experience. </p>
<p>When things like this happen it's so disheartning, but I do believe everything happens for a reason. I've seen it time and time again...just like Mat's experience. </p> Mat that's horrible however i…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-09:502551:Comment:11935582011-05-09T17:40:56.904ZChaserhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/Chaser
<p>Mat that's horrible however it was certainly a blessing in disguise!</p>
<p> </p>
<p>-C</p>
<p><br></br> <cite>Mat von Kroeker said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.recruitingblogs.com/forum/topics/backdoor-references?commentId=502551%3AComment%3A1193270&xg_source=msg_com_forum#502551Comment1193270"><div>I had a similar experience years ago where my superbly qualified, passive candidate had gone through 3 interviews with HR, the IT "team", CFO, CIO and the like--- amounting to hours…</div>
</blockquote>
<p>Mat that's horrible however it was certainly a blessing in disguise!</p>
<p> </p>
<p>-C</p>
<p><br/> <cite>Mat von Kroeker said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.recruitingblogs.com/forum/topics/backdoor-references?commentId=502551%3AComment%3A1193270&xg_source=msg_com_forum#502551Comment1193270"><div>I had a similar experience years ago where my superbly qualified, passive candidate had gone through 3 interviews with HR, the IT "team", CFO, CIO and the like--- amounting to hours of off time and travel--- and everything seemed to be directed towards a bonified hire. She was two hours in her fourth interview with the CEO-- chemistry was through the roof, expectations of project responsibilities and deliverables, talks of salary, start dates, etc. were already finalized. At what clearly looked like a done deal, slam dunk, "a given"--- on a last second whim as my candidate is literally walking out the door, the CEO says "Hey-- while you're here, I'd like you to meet my secretary." As it turned out, the secretary was cold, curt, vindictive for whatever reason--- and put the backdoor khabosh on the whole deal. My candidate was livid to say the least--- and convinced it was purely out of jealousy of her looks, and couldn't believe a company would allow a lower level secretary's opinion (no disrespect to secretaries now) effect executive's opinion's of extremely high level position's and candidate hires. In the long run, it was concluded that my candidate probably dodged a major bullet with this particular company anyway.<br/><br/>Without naming names, within two months, the company was spiraling into bankrupcy, and up for indictment for some of the worst subprime loans manipulation in the country. I'd have to say, in some instances, if the hiring manager or executive in charge of a final decision is that easily swayed? Consider it a welcome red flag.</div>
</blockquote> I had a similar experience ye…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-09:502551:Comment:11932702011-05-09T17:31:32.081ZMat von Kroekerhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/MatvonKroeker
I had a similar experience years ago where my superbly qualified, passive candidate had gone through 3 interviews with HR, the IT "team", CFO, CIO and the like--- amounting to hours of off time and travel--- and everything seemed to be directed towards a bonified hire. She was two hours in her fourth interview with the CEO-- chemistry was through the roof, expectations of project responsibilities and deliverables, talks of salary, start dates, etc. were already finalized. At what clearly…
I had a similar experience years ago where my superbly qualified, passive candidate had gone through 3 interviews with HR, the IT "team", CFO, CIO and the like--- amounting to hours of off time and travel--- and everything seemed to be directed towards a bonified hire. She was two hours in her fourth interview with the CEO-- chemistry was through the roof, expectations of project responsibilities and deliverables, talks of salary, start dates, etc. were already finalized. At what clearly looked like a done deal, slam dunk, "a given"--- on a last second whim as my candidate is literally walking out the door, the CEO says "Hey-- while you're here, I'd like you to meet my secretary." As it turned out, the secretary was cold, curt, vindictive for whatever reason--- and put the backdoor khabosh on the whole deal. My candidate was livid to say the least--- and convinced it was purely out of jealousy of her looks, and couldn't believe a company would allow a lower level secretary's opinion (no disrespect to secretaries now) effect executive's opinion's of extremely high level position's and candidate hires. In the long run, it was concluded that my candidate probably dodged a major bullet with this particular company anyway.<br/><br/>Without naming names, within two months, the company was spiraling into bankrupcy, and up for indictment for some of the worst subprime loans manipulation in the country. I'd have to say, in some instances, if the hiring manager or executive in charge of a final decision is that easily swayed? Consider it a welcome red flag. Agree again Sandra...as menti…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-09:502551:Comment:11937252011-05-09T17:06:33.682ZChaserhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/Chaser
<p>Agree again Sandra...as mentioned my old self was acting up over the weekend. So I went out and found other candidates that merit consideration and one of the replies I get after submittal..."Our IT Staff needs to be 20-30 miles within our location"....AYFKM! The guy lives 40 miles away (I Goggled it) ...In fact is willing to relocate himself closer should the commute prove to be a headache..."And we're not considering any candidates that are willing to relocate…</p>
<p>Agree again Sandra...as mentioned my old self was acting up over the weekend. So I went out and found other candidates that merit consideration and one of the replies I get after submittal..."Our IT Staff needs to be 20-30 miles within our location"....AYFKM! The guy lives 40 miles away (I Goggled it) ...In fact is willing to relocate himself closer should the commute prove to be a headache..."And we're not considering any candidates that are willing to relocate themselves"..............</p>
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<p>lost for words and actually feel bad for them...This position has been open for a long time...It will continue to be.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>-C</p>
<p> </p>
<p><cite>Sandra McCartt said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.recruitingblogs.com/forum/topics/backdoor-references?commentId=502551%3AComment%3A1193533&xg_source=msg_com_forum#502551Comment1193257"><div><p>We have probably all thought about it at times when these situations occur and we become aware of a murder by gossip situation. Take a step back and think about it. It most probably has nothing to do with the VP of IT. He/she has probably gotten the word from another employee who worked with your candidate or knows someone who worked with your candidate in the past. They either do not like your candidate or they believe what they have passed on. Whateve the situation is it appears that the company has chosen to believe whoever passed on the backdoor reference. Tracking it down, stirring things up or whatever the result might be would not seem to be a help to anyone.</p>
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<p>Also consider the possibility that your candidate may have some other flaws that you are not aware of and they have used the "not hands on enough" excuse when it may be something else.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>I would suggest taking your candidate to a more friendly environment which is in his best interest and finding another candidate for this company which is in their and your best interest. It is always a temptation to tilt at windmills but it hardly ever helps anyone involved to try and force something in a situation where a backdoor reference has caused a problem. Somebody somewhere has an axe to grind. Why chop off your own foot with someone else's axe?</p>
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</blockquote> I wasn't clear enough in my p…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-09:502551:Comment:11939042011-05-09T17:04:48.588ZPaul S. Gumbinnerhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/PaulSGumbinner
<p>I wasn't clear enough in my previous answer. When I get a negative reference on a candidate (sometimes even from names the candidate provided), i redouble my efforts, sometimes even calling back people I had previously spoken to to determine the nature of the relationship between my candidate and the person who gave the negative reference. If there is a negative, I will also ask my other references, including the people I had previously called, to comment on the negative issue. On a few…</p>
<p>I wasn't clear enough in my previous answer. When I get a negative reference on a candidate (sometimes even from names the candidate provided), i redouble my efforts, sometimes even calling back people I had previously spoken to to determine the nature of the relationship between my candidate and the person who gave the negative reference. If there is a negative, I will also ask my other references, including the people I had previously called, to comment on the negative issue. On a few occasions I have found out it was true, but mostly, the others will come up with a plausible explanation for the negativity.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>I once had a creative director at an ad agency tell me that an account guy was lazy. I called six different people to get a read on that. All of the others - people the account guy worked for and people who worked with him as well as two clients - said that he was decidedly not lazy. Then I spoke to a seventh reference who put it in perspective. Of course the creative director said that. The client fired the agency because of poor creative work (actually a rare reason for terminating an ad agency). The creative guy, in order to shield himself from criticism, had developed an entirely false scenario which blamed the account person for the loss of the account. Made sense to me. Fortunately, to my client as well.</p> That really blows that it had…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-05-09:502551:Comment:11935522011-05-09T16:51:14.386ZChaserhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/Chaser
That really blows that it had to happen after the interview and that they couldn't trust their own feelings and judgement (however its also a blessing that the candidate got the interview and that they interviewed him for as long as they did). Because now they're obviously just as<br />
much at fault for not recognizing this in the 3+ hours of interviews<br />
with him. They cant fall on the sword and are looking for an escape goat...Guess who that lucky goat gets to be...The Recruiter. …
That really blows that it had to happen after the interview and that they couldn't trust their own feelings and judgement (however its also a blessing that the candidate got the interview and that they interviewed him for as long as they did). Because now they're obviously just as<br />
much at fault for not recognizing this in the 3+ hours of interviews<br />
with him. They cant fall on the sword and are looking for an escape goat...Guess who that lucky goat gets to be...The Recruiter. Yayyyy<br/>
<cite>Scott Pugh said:</cite><br />
<blockquote cite="http://www.recruitingblogs.com/forum/topics/backdoor-references?commentId=502551%3AComment%3A1193533&xg_source=msg_com_forum#502551Comment1193705"><div><p>This just happened to me. I won't go into much detail but decided to stop working on it immediately. They LOVED the candidate. They interviewed them for 3 hours longer than scheduled.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Then the negative, unsolicited backdoor reference happened. The candidate was painted as a loose cannon, psycho. At first, I felt lucky that they uncovered something. However, the client had a "why did you send us this terrible candidate" attitude after clearly giving him their seal of approval after meeting him. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>The client is now in my high risk category and I won't risk spending time on their urgent search.</p>
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