world-class recruiters offering high value-add services difficult to eliminate, automate, or outsource. Most of the folks being discussed here as employees or contractors won’t factor in, because while some may be quite good, they probably won’t be quite good enough to compete in this new market.
Keith “What makes YOU so special?” Halperin
KarenM / Hirecentrix.com said:JimI respect your comments but I also disagree. These rules don't stink, and there are many companies, including recruiting companies that have grown extensively by hiring individuals the correct way!What made this country fail is Greed and Fraud.. when you screw the employees over, and cheapen labor, then there is no one left to buy the product that you have to sell.. It is Reaganomics in Reverse.. That is what happened in America.. -- IT is THIS fraud and Abuse THAT GOT us into this recession in the first placeYou can't keep Feeding the Top of the Tree, ignore the base and the Roots, and expect the tree to survive.. 98 Percent of the Population are the Roots and base of the treeFor the past 8 years, our misery index Rose to abnormal highs, whilst were were lied to about how great the economy was.. We saw more and more Americans have their jobs displaced by foreign labor, - Cheap foreign labor..Did the product get cheaper in Cost? No, but it got cheaply made, and guess what, with the jobs lost, there became less and less consumer buying power..The CEO's got richer.. and We see that 98 Percent of America's wealth was controlled by 2 percent of the Population.. These people by the way don't buy the Mass produced product that Most companies manufacture, produce or service..So who was left to buy the Mass product? You? me? the average Joe who didn't have a job anymore? or the individuals in his neighbourhood who depended on his dollar..It was the individuals who perpetuated the fraud and said, He employee, we don't care about You, and what You bring to the table.. we only care about making sure that My OffShore Account gets' bigger.. and who cares if I lose my job, or the company get's bankrupt.. shoot my pocket is full.Jim, in American the Small Business is the Largest Employer.. and yes, there are many who grow effectively, and prosperously, w/o having to worry about the IRS or FSLA .They don't worry about the IRS or FSLA, because they don't try to Cheat their Employees, and they don't try to screw the system.. which in the longrun, creates Extremely anti competitive and Unfair business practices..AND I AM a small business owner -- actually I own 2 today.. and Hopefully will be employing employees with our growth.. Retention I believe will not be a problem, because I plan to pay fairly and competitively..Wow, thanks for letting me get this off my chest..and No, I don't think that these Rules SUCK -- because I have been an Employee, like most of the World, and I know what it is liked to be abused and screwed over by employers.. where your hard work is taken advantage of, not recognized, and definitely not reimbursed as it should be or as promised..karenJim Durbin said:This discussion is one of the reasons it's going to be so hard to pull ourselves out of recession.You'd have to be a bloody fool to hire employees if the IRS and DOL start really cracking down on businesses. These rules supposedly help employees, but what they really do is make sure that only large companies with money to pay for employment attorneys ever do the hiring. In countries that make it hard to hire, unemployment is endemic (France and Germany), or underground (Italy). The pain of getting rid of a bad worker is so high, companies are reluctant to hire, which leads to 10% unemployment and (50% for people under the age of 25).Most recruiters are small businesses, but as is very clear, you can lose your business if you hire someone. You take all the risk, and the employee gets "taken care of" by the nanny state government, which is really just bureaucrats without the ability to run businesses themselves.Take a look at how many staffing firm owners layed off all of their employees, cover their own reqs, and now make as much net profit as they did with a lot less stress. Ask them if it's worth it to hire someone, train them, and hope it works out. Especially with taxes clearing needing to go up to 50% on high earners to cover our debt, more strict rules, less overall business, and so much paperwork that you don't get to actually do your job.Karen, you might be right about the rules, but the rules stink.Again I say - Who is John Galt?
ou really want TPR's to work on the same retention metric as your internal recruiters, here's the deal. You pay me a monthly retainer equal to your most experienced recruiter for a year, plus another allowance to equal the % of that retainer that equates to the benefits your internals receive, plus matching my 401K contribution at the same % as your internals. In addition you pay my phone bill, my office rent, the cost of any advertising i do for your positions, job board costs, furnish me a computer, internet costs, ats, tech support, two to three weeks paid vacation, overtime after 5:00 and weekends or no overtime if your internals are exempt. Oh, and you pay half my self employment tax on that retainer. That should level the playing field with your internals on base comp package.In addition i will need full access to all your hiring managers without having to go through one of your internals, a listing for every job you have for the year, be included in all recruiting meetings, strategy sessions, planning sessions, make me aware of every potential termination in advance and every promotion so i have a little lead time to be on top of it when the HM is ready to backfill. I get to be involved in the onboarding, have access to the new employee during training and orientation. And of course since i'm new you won't expect me to produce much for the first 30 to 60 days until i get up to speed on the company , people and culture.Now about that bonus for retention on top of all the comp and conditions that will make me as a TPR equal to your internals ...sure, you betcha, i'm in, onboard, let's roll. Go buy the gold watches. What's my bonus potential for retention???If that is not acceptable then maybe since i don't cost you anything until i produce a better candidate than your internals can identify or find one they can't and your HM's hire them and they stay 90 days or i do it all over again at no cost to you ,plus if i want to continue to recruit for you my referrals that you hire need to perform above average ...maybe i have earned my fee when my candidate is hired and completes the guarantee period.Not to mention that if i don't produce and my hired candidates don't stay put you don't have to fire me, you just don't call or write or send flowers, you can just hit delete and i'm gone. No severence, no pool, no pets, no tickee, no washee, no wrongful firing, no unemployment claims. Let's face it , i'm a cheap date and i never have a headache.Now really, i perform a service just like the priest who married you. Would you expect to tie his fee for service to the fact that you and your spouse got a divorce in the first year or two after you were married. Would you expect to only pay your lawyer if you got the settlement you wanted.
real person. Please if you believe that do not every try online dating. Don't buy something from somebody on Craig's List who wants you to come pick it up. In the next five minutes any of us could set up all kinds of profiles all over the place. Recruiters are prostituting themselves like a bunch of cheap camp followers by the thousands.
I am not berating you guys for wanting to believe that everything you see on the internet has a lovely person connected to it. I thought Rebecca of Sunny Brook Farm was a doll and i love her basket of daiseys.
As Kyle so well stated, we hold ourselves out there as the authority, telling candidates not to spam companies with their resumes, not to do mass mailings of their resumes flung like dung against a wall. then we have a debate about writing nicey nice notes to a dung flunging spammer cause her really did flung dung. Or the question may be how much dung did a dung flunger, flung if a dung flunger did flung dung. An incredible amount and this one got some dung flung back at her for dung flunging. No sweet girls i am not going to write nicey nice notes to a dung flunger, the nigerian princess of recruiting or anybody else who fills cyberspace with bulk emails. Every candidate i have who is above the level of high school is getting this crap from lots of somebodys who have a computer, a linkedin profile and a twitter account.We used to say that anybody with a desk and telephone could call themselves a recruiter, now it doesn't even take a desk or a telephone. Just internet access and they can be anybody they want to be.
If Kathy at Thor group is a real person, she done flung dung and it splashed back on her. Maybe she learned something if she is real. If she is a phony profile maybe Thor will raise their magic hammer and quit spamming every email address on the internet.
Let's practice what we preach to our candidates, what we preach to other recruiters about driving clients crazy with unsolicited phone calls and emails about that perfect candidate who doesn't fit anything they ever wanted or needed or asked for ever. Let's not say it's just an itty bitty mistake when a recruiter spams the populace at large. It's shoddy business practice, it irritates the living hell out of most people who get the spam just like it did Megan.
The reason there are "no call lists " to block numbers for telemarketers is because of the abuse and intrusion of unwanted irritating calls. Maybe a few more Kathys and people will start blocking all emails that have the word recruiter in it. Trust me we are fast approaching a situation where this is going to be addressed, along with phony profiles on Facebook , LInkedin and every social network where recruiters are blasting the multitudes.
Ticket to DumbAssIsland has been punched. All ashore who are going ashore. Dont think i will take that cruise.
The First rule of sales is don't irritate the customer.