Search Results - formed Virgin

Blog Post: Interview Spotlight with Our HR Specialists: For Jennifer Carpenter's blog post this week, she interviewed two of iCIMS’own Human Resources…; Added by Samantha at 9:30am on July 24, 2012

Blog Post: Airline Pilot Recruitment and Interviews

Airline Pilot Interviews

By Jason Robinson

Globally, airline pilot recruitment this year is expected to be tight with large numbers of qualified pilots competing for the limited…

Added by Flight Deck at 10:51pm on December 31, 2014

Blog Post: 3 Recruiting Technologies & Tools Changing the Future of Hiring: This is the third time I’ve had the honor of judging the iTalent competition…; Added by Matt Charney at 2:27pm on November 20, 2013

Blog Post: How to Scale Your Recruitment Business: Added by Rhys Jones at 10:10am on November 23, 2020

Topic: Transcript - Talent Talk Cafe: Week of Nov 17th - Jerry Albright on Agency Recruitment Best Practies and Processes: st the tip of the Chat and I'm sure we'll see this continue in December! Following is an overview of Jerry's topic and the Chat transcript. You can also find Jerry online HERE! 3:03pm Susan Burns It all yours Jerry! 3:03pm Maren Hogan Let's hear it for the boy 3:03pm Jerry Albright thanks! 3:03pm Susan Burns (hi Pam! hi Josh - long time Josh!) 3:03pm Julia Stone clap, clap, whistle 3:03pm Jerry Albright That makes me laugh Maren! 3:03pm Joshua Letourneau hi, susan :) 3:03pm Maren Hogan :) 3:04pm Susan Burns Hey roomie! 3:04pm Jerry Albright I see the crowd is getting just a bit bigger each time with TTC. 3:04pm Jerry Albright Today's theme is Agency Recruiting 3:04pm Kondalarao :-) 3:04pm Jerry Albright I'm not an expert in social media, ATS, branding or the other stuff. 3:05pm Jerry Albright and today I'm just going to throw out some of the principals I personally stick with. 3:05pm Jerry Albright i wish I could type faster! 3:05pm Jerry Albright let me dig one up here for you... 3:06pm Jerry Albright 11. If your client is within a days drive – you MUST meet them personally. 3:06pm Jerry Albright These are just random by the way - you can tell that's number 11. 3:06pm Jerry Albright Do you visit your clients? 3:06pm Susan Burns I like that Jerry! We understimate the f2f time 3:06pm Maren Hogan Do you always have to bring food? Seems like vendoras always bring food 3:07pm Julia Stone absofreakinlulely 3:07pm Jerry Albright I never do. 3:07pm Jerry Albright should I? 3:07pm Maren Hogan around christmas it starts to irritate me 3:07pm Joshua Letourneau i bring rubber frogs - seriously :) well, jelly ones 3:07pm A Lonnie McRorey what are vendoras? 3:07pm Susan Burns Food is good - calculators are bad! 3:07pm Maren Hogan I don't know. Tell me, if I am a brands new recruiter (:) what is the ONE process I should have in place 3:07pm Maren Hogan vendoras=vendors 3:07pm Jerry Albright OK. So I personally believe you should meet absolutely EVERY client that gives you a job order. 3:07pm Joshua Letourneau they're good for stress relief and adults are kinesthetic (give 'em somethin to play with and their brain fires more) :) 3:08pm Jerry Albright I've lost the crowd already Susan............ 3:08pm Julia Stone I'm with you 3:08pm Maren Hogan before or after they've given you the order Jerry? 3:08pm Sue so am I 3:08pm Susan Burns I think u got em rolling on ideas Jerry! 3:08pm A Lonnie McRorey Close to the Spanish of Vendedoras 3:08pm Carol Thornton go ahead! 3:08pm Julia Stone ribbit, stay focused Lonnie 3:08pm Jerry Albright I go after I take the order. It's part of my process. 3:08pm Jerry Albright If they won't make time to see me.... 3:09pm Sue suppose they don't want to meet w/u 3:09pm Jerry Albright then I'm doubting they will make time to work with me 3:09pm Carol Thornton What if your clients are all over the country and F2F is not an option? 3:09pm Jerry Albright it really is that simple Sue. Really. 3:09pm Julia Stone I agree with Jerry. I have another one too, can I add? 3:09pm Jerry Albright Good point Carol. 3:09pm Susan Burns Jerry - how do u frame the purpose of the meeting 3:10pm Jerry Albright I just let them know that since I'll be representing them I would like to get to know them better. 3:10pm Joshua Letourneau can i interject a fringe idea? a small one . .. 3:10pm Susan Burns So prupose is tied to outome - as we get to know each other I can represent your brand better? 3:10pm pam claughton It's to their benefit to meet with you as you'll get a better sense of their environment. 3:10pm Susan Burns Josh - yes Julia - yes!! 3:10pm Julia Stone I have a 3 page intake form that I use during my initial meeting, I pick & choose. 3:11pm Jerry Albright Oh I forgot. 3:11pm Sue that is a good idea intake form 3:11pm Susan Burns pick and choose questions to ask or clients to take on 3:11pm Joshua Letourneau can you bring a flip cam and interview some 'co-workers' to help give the candidate a better feel of the culture/environment? 3:11pm Jerry Albright The term is "intake" now.....sorry PC Cops - I'll never say "job order" again....my bad 3:11pm pam claughton Josh, that's a fun idea! 3:11pm Susan Burns great idea Josh - don't forget the release form ;-) 3:11pm Julia Stone I bring an intake form to ask questions about teh company, culture, management style, etc 3:11pm Julia Stone One time, I asked what is your management style, he said...What's the right answer? 3:11pm Joshua Letourneau i'd probably wind up in jail :) 3:12pm Jerry Albright My goal in meeting my client is to get to know HIM or HER better. 3:12pm Susan Burns Jerry - how often do clients decline the meeting and what are the reasons they give 3:12pm Jerry Albright They rarely do. I'll admit - some meetings are short. 3:13pm Dean Lockett and to get face time with the watchdog of the office - get them to recognize you 3:13pm Jerry Albright But any client serious about hiring would certainly want to meet don't you think? 3:13pm Cathy McCullough do you "benchmark" resumes? I find that helps because it turns the conversation from a wish list to a reality check 3:13pm Maren Hogan Do you think that it shows something about your commitment to go there even for a ten minute meeting? 3:13pm Jerry Albright as I've mentioned before - I show up early and hang out in the cozy lobby seeing whose coming and going. 3:13pm Joshua Letourneau 'cuz they're working with 10 other firms on a vendor list or thorugh an online VMS . . . so they just want tons of resumes 3:13pm Susan Burns I agree - I always appreciate it from vendors - esp if they are focused and have a purpose & intention that will benefit the biz 3:13pm Jerry Albright Maren - yes. 3:13pm Dean Lockett Suggest team meetings if possible - I've gotten that on a first meet before 3:14pm Jerry Albright Your a heavy hitter Dean. 3:14pm Jerry Albright This is a fact: 3:14pm pam claughton I think they take you more seriously too if they invest a little time to meet with you. Shows you that they want to get the job filled. 3:14pm Susan Burns Quick interruption - can someone with IE please copy the chat stream at the end so I can paste the Chat in the Forum - Thanks! 3:14pm Julia Stone if I don't understand the culture & get to see the place, how can I possibly place the right person. I am not a magician. At least not professionally 3:14pm Jerry Albright If a client does not want to meet you - then they do not value you or your time. 3:15pm Joshua Letourneau jer, that's when you pull a D-Trump on 'em 3:15pm Gregg Alper how would you gauge who is serious and who isn't with clients not in your area that you can't meet? 3:15pm Susan Burns Ideally this investemtn in the beginning should return more "right-fit" candidates so its a good investment of time 3:15pm A Lonnie McRorey Jerry do you focus on the painful spots from the get go? 3:15pm pam claughton If they move into new space, good idea to go back in for a visit too. 3:15pm Jerry Albright Let's go with Gregg's Q here. 3:15pm Carol Thornton I can't meet with my clients so I talk to them about where they have gotten good people from in the past. This gives me a culture idea 3:15pm Julia Stone Julia's rule...I don't like to work with anyone who won't give me their cell phone number. 3:15pm Jerry Albright OK. Gregg you work long distance clients? 3:15pm pam claughton Julia, that's interesting, how did that come about? 3:15pm Dean Lockett In your meeting with HM, let them know you are looking for a sponsor to intro you to other HM's AFTER you've taken care of the person ur meeting with of course 3:16pm Susan Burns Gregg - maybe a Skype meeting if an alternative to close the distance or at least a conf call 3:16pm Gregg Alper yes. i am on east coast, some clients on the west. 3:16pm Jerry Albright If that's the case you can still gauge whether they value your time or not. 3:16pm Gregg Alper thats a good idea 3:16pm Jerry Albright Gregg - ask them to call you back. 3:16pmpam claughton You can often tell how serious they are too by how they respond to your initial submissions 3:16pm Julia Stone Well, they want us to spend 2-3 weeks worth of time with the possiblity of no pay at the end. I want to see if they are going to put any skin in the game 3:16pm Joshua Letourneau if you super-niche yourself, you can still work a large geography range . . . but i always try (at some point) to physically meet 3:17pm Dean Lockett www.gotomeeting.com might be an option 3:17pm Gregg Alper like what kind of niche Joshua? 3:17pm Jerry Albright But just how far away would a client have to be to think you wouldn't want to meet them? 3:17pm Joshua Letourneau for me, i spend most search time in a small engineering area where the candidate pool is finite 3:17pm Carol Thornton I'm in ATL and my clients are in Chicago, Dallas, Philly, etc 3:17pm pam claughton A friend of mine works the Boston area but lives in Upstate NY and she visits all her Boston clients, a 4 hour drive at least. 3:18pm Carol Thornton too far to drive 3:18pm Jerry Albright It would show them alot if you flew in 3:18pm Joshua Letourneau gregg, perhaps opto-electronics engineering or something along those lines (and then you can branch out to operational roles around that niche as well) 3:18pm Susan Burns Carol - is it worth the investment to do a quarterly touch base with past, current and prospective clients. Is there enough in each market? 3:18pm Shannon Myers Conferences are a good place to at least meet your clients. 3:18pm Jerry Albright seriously. what's $500 when you think about a 20K fee? 3:19pm Jerry Albright I wouldn't do it every time Carol. 3:19pm Julia Stone I met a client in ATL at a conference in sept, it was extremely helpful in moving us to the next level 3:19pm Carol Thornton true, but usually one client in each location 3:19pm Jerry Albright but I'd certainly meet every client who hired from me - regardless of location. 3:19pm Joshua Letourneau jer, a small co-tainer up front can help offset that as well (a $1k engagement fee or something along those lines) 3:19pm Carol Thornton I staff for managers and execs within the staffing industry so my clients are spread out 3:20pm Jerry Albright that might work. it's not my style though. 3:20pm Susan Burns Is an online meeting as valuable - can you close the virtual distance and get the same results? 3:20pm Jerry Albright I have no idea. 3:20pm Susan Burns Lets keep in mind being green too - maybe there's a way to leverage the idea of virutal? 3:20pm Julia Stone no, i don't hink so susan, it might be better than a call, but ti might just be a pain to them if they don't have a set up to do it 3:20pm Jerry Albright anything that moves your relationship forward is a good idea. 3:20pm Maren Hogan I think it's like being a good writer or having a skill, some people can do the virtual thing and others hate it 3:20pm Joshua Letourneau i've tried that, susan - but it's not the same as doing body shots with HR :) 3:20pm Maren Hogan The actual skill lies in being able to make others feel comfortable 3:21pm Gregg Alper thats not bad. i have mostly been IT and looking at other fields to focus more on one niche area 3:21pm Jerry Albright Ready for the next Random Principal? 3:21pm Carol Thornton yes 3:21pm Jerry Albright OK. Just a sec. 3:21pm Susan Burns Give us #10 Jerry!! 3:22pm Jerry Albright 14. Remove Caller ID from your phone. 3:22pm pam claughton Really, why? 3:22pm Julia Stone incoming or outgoing jer? 3:22pm pam claughton I love my caller ID :) 3:22pm Jerry Albright I want to receive each call with the same enthusiasm 3:22pm Jerry Albright incoming Julia. 3:23pm Maren Hogan #15 don't give your cousin your work phone number 3:23pm Julia Stone if that is the goal, might I also suggest standing up when you answer calls or make them? 3:23pm Jerry Albright Sure. 3:23pm Julia Stone I suggest you stand up when making calls 3:23pm Jerry Albright That's funny. 3:23pm pam claughton I think I'm a techie geek...I like knowing whose calling in. 3:24pm Cathy McCullough Also, you should consider shutting down IM and email when making recruiting calls. 3:24pm Jerry Albright so OK then - stick with your caller ID. 3:24pm Shannon Myers I would have trouble with that as well 3:24pm Julia Stone agreed cathy, I turn of my monitor 3:24pm pam claughton that's a good suggestion....email can be distracting 3:24pm Jerry Albright I take every call if I am in. No matter what. 3:25pm Jerry Albright 12. Do not assume anything – like an unemployed person can start right away or “any reasonable offer” will be accepted. Have the discussion with every person – every time. 3:25pm pam claughton twhirl is the most distracting thing on my desktop...have to shut it down often 3:25pm Susan Burns Jerry - is there something thats driving #12 - what has been your experience and is it shifting with the economy and hosing market?? 3:26pm Julia Stone wow, insightful jerry. I have learned that there is no such thing as overcommunicating, but I just learned it this year 3:26pm Susan Burns oops- housing! althouh we are all getting hosed!! 3:26pm pam claughton #12 is the most critical thing. you need to know everything and anything can change from day to day. 3:26pm Jerry Albright Assumptions kills us every time. 3:26pm Joshua Letourneau "has anything changed?" is the question that has to be asked each and every conversation . .. to the point they're telling you "No" before you even ask 3:26pm Susan Burns Pam - how often do you follow-up to make sure the candidate is still on track with agreements? 3:26pm Jerry Albright no Josh. not "has" anything changed. 3:27pm pam claughton every time I talk to them, even it's daily. 3:27pm Jerry Albright it is "WHAT HAS CHANGED" and then be quiet....... 3:27pm Joshua Letourneau touche - i like that 3:27pm Jerry Albright huuuuuuuge difference there. 3:27pm pam claughton especially if they're a good candidate, an offer in hand can change their notion of what they now want. 3:27pm Dean Lockett who,what,where,when,how, why - all open end starters 3:27pm A Lonnie McRorey Powerful 3:27pm Jerry Albright but "has" anything changed is Far better than..... 3:27pm Jerry Albright "Nothing's changed, right?....." 3:28pm Joshua Letourneau the point is, "ask" and be cognizant that things do, in fact, change - i don't know if there are perfect questions for every candidate . .. but i agree with "what's changed?" 3:28pm Jerry Albright pretty heavy indeed. 3:28pm pam claughton Or they may have gotten a raise, and that can impact what you need to close them on. 3:29pm Dean Lockett Or their company just filed Chap 11 - happened to meX-( 3:29pm Jerry Albright 28. Before you extend an offer to your candidate – take 1 hour and do something else. 3:29pm pam claughton More common, in this market, since the last time you spoke even if its just a few days, they may now be unemployed. Several of my candidates were laid off this week! 3:29pm Jerry Albright 28. Before you extend an offer to your candidate – take 1 hour and do something else. 3:29pm Susan Burns i would imagine as well that with the current economic climate any new news could make them more skittish about making a move 3:30pm pam claughton Yes, Susan that is very true too. 3:30pm Joshua Letourneau susan, Bingo - that's my situation 3:30pm Joshua Letourneau especially clients that insist on relo for all roles 3:30pm Susan Burns noone wants to be the new kid on the block unless they are currently unemployed 3:30pm pam claughton I had someone cancel an in-house interview today because he didn't want to jeopardize his current contract situation. 3:30pm Shannon Myers Jer - 1 hour to do? 3:31pm pam claughton very strange market indeed. 3:31pm Susan Burns THanks Shanon - keep us focused! 3:31pm Jerry Albright Shannon - reflect 3:31pm Jerry Albright I remember my first offer. I was SO excited. I was going to just hop on the phone with the candidate! 3:31pm Gregg Alper i've had that. recently had a guy not want to pursue a spot that was a 2 year project because of his concerns and would rather finish out the current project that ends next month and then figure things out. to me that is crazy 3:31pm Maren Hogan So ";Do you have any spare change?" would be what. . .wrong? 3:31pm Jerry Albright my mentor said - HEY! Wait a minute! 3:32pm Dean Lockett review notes, bounce it off someone else, might catch something there u missed? 3:32pm Jerry Albright could be anything. 3:32pm pam claughton Gregg, I agree, my guy had a similar mindset. Nutty. 3:32pm Jerry Albright how about just enjoying what you have in your hand! 3:32pm Susan Burns Jerry - do you tend to alter anything in your offer approach given the current biz climate? 3:32pm Jerry Albright no. 3:32pm Jerry Albright not really. 3:32pm Dean Lockett I do that after offer signed and person shows up to the dance ;-) 3:32pm pam claughton Jerry, would you advise calling to pre-close at that point? 3:33pm Jerry Albright What do you mean Pam? 3:33pm pam claughton Well you said wait an hour...am assuming you've already pre-closed, but maybe not everyone here does that as a matter fo course before extending? 3:34pm Eric Gilson Shouldn't your candidate be pre-closed well in advance to this 3:34pm Dean Lockett Whole nuther chat could be applied to "pre-close" 3:34pm pam claughton Yes, Eric they should be, but this is where many new recruiters skip the crucial step i ntheir excitement. 3:34pm Jerry Albright They should have been closed on "let's go get an offer you'll accept" prior 3:34pm Rayanne you should always pre-close..., ie; "what would it take to land you?" 3:35pm Rayanne "hav you thought about a counter-offer?" 3:35pm Jerry Albright Usually your candidate and you have been working on "the things that need to be there" in advance. 3:35pm Dean Lockett what does your spose think about this oppty? 3:35pm Eric Gilson We don't present offers unless we are sure it is going to be accepted 3:35pm Joshua Letourneau i like to say, "so you're looking for 250 . . . but will take 30k, right?" :P don't try that at home 3:35pm Dean Lockett spouse ...sorry 3:35pm Jerry Albright correct Eric. 3:35pm Jim - medXcentral @eric... isn't that the point of Pre or test closing? 3:35pm Jim - medXcentral to be sure... 3:35pm Susan Burns Dean - very important - and that should be checked early and often. Have seen it kill mamy a deal late in the process 3:35pm pam claughton Yes, I don't like surprises...I pre-close more than once generally because things are fluid and often changing. 3:35pm Eric Gilson yes 3:35pm Rayanne "would you say no to...?" 3:36pm Jerry Albright What I hate is when the HR dept offers them the job directly and says "let us know within 5 days!" 3:36pm Julia Stone one of Julia's favorites: Can I accept the offer on your behalf ? 3:36pm Rayanne hate that too 3:36pm pam claughton Yes, I hate that. 3:36pm Eric Gilson We don't let our clients present the offer 3:36pm Eric Gilson That is what we do 3:36pm Shannon Myers I ask that one too Julia 3:36pm Rayanne I ate an HR dept that changes the comp offered... 3:36pm Dean Lockett that's part of pre-close with HR, but still happens 3:36pm Rayanne *hate 3:36pm pam claughton I always have them call the client to accept directly with them...seems more binding and they both love it. 3:36pm Joshua Letourneau yeah, HR sometimes wants to "stick to their process" (the same one that leads to 20% fallouts for them) 3:37pm Jerry Albright Eric - there's always a rogue HR member out there - be careful! 3:37pm Susan Burns So its ok for acceptance to go directly to the client but not for client to extend the offer - logic?? 3:37pm Eric Gilson exactly Josh 3:37pm Rayanne true 3:37pm Jerry Albright Susan 3:37pm Joshua Letourneau i'm just playing :) but I run into that like everyone else sometimes 3:37pm Susan Burns Hey - careful about that HR thing ;-) 3:37pm Jerry Albright offer extension is sales. 3:37pm Shannon Myers One firm I worked with did offer with candidate then conferenced in HR to do official acceptance 3:37pm Jerry Albright HR is not typically a "closer" 3:37pm pam claughton Susan it's a control thing. They accept with me, and then with the clinet. If the client extends, too many things can go wrong as they don't close as well as we do. 3:37pm Susan Burns But are u dealing with HR generalist or with Recruiters? 3:37pm Jerry Albright they leave it quite open actually.....:( 3:38pm pam claughton it varies 3:38pm Eric Gilson Success is more likely when the driver of the process has a vested interest in the deal 3:38pm Susan Burns oh this is painful to hear! I gues I've been lucky to have very good recruiters working with me! 3:38pm Maren Hogan whoa go new guy! 3:39pm Joshua Letourneau a great trainer once told me that HR relies on us to use our own process - it's the only way we should take on the search with any degree of comfort (i.e. anything less is not an A+ assignment) 3:39pm pam claughton Susan, it's also what the client is paying us to do. 3:39pm Rayanne You can head off mos tof these problems by keeping open communication 3:39pm Rayanne maybe even have the negotiation and offer process mentioned in your contract or proposal 3:39pm Susan Burns Pam - if its in the SLA i agree 3:39pm Rayanne true, Josh 3:40pm Jerry Albright OK. So where are we? 3:40pm Dean Lockett what's lucky #13 Jer? 3:40pm Jerry Albright I skip that number 3:40pm Susan Burns Just to provide an laternate view - I have worked with TPR with great success but it was the internal recruiter that extended the offer - it forms an important bond at the beginning 3:40pm Rayanne good 3:40pm Dean Lockett face ur fears ;-) 3:41pm Jerry Albright that's one of my random principals Dean. 3:41pm Jerry Albright but we don't have time for it today. 3:41pm Joshua Letourneau agreed, susan - this does work with good communication. i couldn't agree more (to pam's point of pre-closing) 3:41pm Dean Lockett that is #13 isn't it? 3:41pm Jerry Albright let's do this one......... 3:41pm Susan Burns ANd Josh - agree that if it not a skilled corp recruiter then the TPR should extend 3:42pm Jerry Albright 25. Our job is not “social work”. If you’re in this profession to primarily “help people” you’re in the wrong field. Sorry :( 3:42pm Joshua Letourneau susan, we're control freaks :P 3:42pm Susan Burns and so are we '-) 3:42pm Rayanne no social work for me 3:42pm pam claughton Susan, agree it can work as long as there's communication and we know what the offer will be and can still pre-close. 3:42pm Rayanne communication is the key Pam 3:42pm Susan Burns Jerry - more info please 3:42pm Rayanne ' 3:43pm Dean Lockett Social doesn't pay the bills, like Social Security :-0 3:43pm Jerry Albright You need to keep your "emotions" off your desk. 3:43pm Eric Gilson absolutely 3:43pm Rayanne Passion is part of this job, though 3:43pm Jerry Albright We're not here to "help people find better jobs". 3:43pm Joshua Letourneau i get satisfaction from "helping people" and changing lives . . . but to your point, i can't help 'everyone' 3:43pm Jerry Albright Oh Rayanne - I'm certainly passionate. 3:43pm Rayanne I know that 3:43pm pam claughton Jerry, true you can't get too vested in any one outcome 3:44pm Eric Gilson How do you know if you are changing their lives for the better? 3:44pm Rayanne but I have certainly become too attached to candidates in the past 3:44pm Joshua Letourneau Eric, great question :) it's all perception, right!!? 3:44pm Susan Burns aren't u also trying to "sell" a better opp? Isn't that part of the pitch? So, I ask - is it authentic and sincere? 3:44pm Jerry Albright There are better jobs. 3:45pm Susan Kang Nam Eric - great question 3:45pm Eric Gilson I look at it as offering them an opportunity 3:45pm Rayanne If it is the right candidate, it isn 3:45pm pam claughton Susan, I think it has to be. 3:45pm Susan Burns Eric - only they can determine that 3:45pm Julia Stone You are being paid to find the best possible person for the job, unless the candidates are paying you 3:45pm Rayanne isn't a "sell" 3:45pm Joshua Letourneau sometimes you absolutely know when you're improving their lives (like when they're close to shooting their current mgr) 3:45pm Eric Gilson Right, so I don't go about my workday thinking I am helping or hurting anyone 3:45pm Jerry Albright Hold on a minute here... 3:45pm Eric Gilson I am just an information broker 3:45pm Joshua Letourneau other times, it's a money play and they know they might make trade-offs for more $$$ (like more travel, longer hrs, etc.) 3:45pm Jerry Albright I'm not saying the people don't benefit. 3:46pm Jerry Albright Of course they do. 3:46pm Rayanne I think of it as bringing all the pieces together 3:46pm pam claughton There's a fine line between pushing someone and showing them, giving them information to see that this role offers what they want. 3:46pm Rayanne When you push, you lose objectivity 3:46pm Julia Stone I don' t think it is a fine line. I just work to know the info before my clients see them 3:46pm Rayanne and it becomes only about the close 3:46pm Jerry Albright I've never pushed in my work 3:46pm Jerry Albright I hate that. 3:46pmpam claughton When you push, either client or candidate, then you have a great chance of a falloff, and those are no fun. 3:46pm Jerry Albright Really I do. 3:47pm Dean Lockett Takeaways are better than pushing 3:47pm Julia Stone ok that made no sense. I mean I need to know their sincerity before submitting them about the company. It NEVER works to push anyone 3:47pm Jerry Albright I use to work with a guy who would never take no for an answer. 3:47pm Rayanne true 3:47pm pam claughton I don't push either, and that's why I have an almost unheard of falloff ratio. :) 3:47pm Rayanne sometimes no is the answer 3:47pm Jerry Albright Then Pam - you're not pushing enough...... 3:47pm Jerry Albright :) 3:47pm Jerry Albright there's a balance there that's for sure. 3:47pm Joshua Letourneau churn n' burn - place n' bill :P 3:48pm Susan Burns From a corp perspective I apprecitae when a TPR can sell the opp but balance with the reality - I want a truly interested and invested candidate by the time they get to my desk 3:48pm Julia Stone I had a candidate the summer who the client wanted 10/10, his interest was a 4/10. I had to tell him to withdraw from the process & I Had to start over. broke my heart but boy did it strengthen my relationship wtih client & candidate 3:48pm Eric Gilson That leads to having to make Marketing Calls Josh 3:48pm Rayanne you did the right thing, Julia 3:48pm Susan Burns Julia- i would hire you with that story! 3:48pm Jerry Albright Gold Star Julia. 3:48pm Julia Stone yep, but it sucked 3:48pm Rayanne yep 3:48pm Julia Stone and i did get teh hire, just took another 2 weeks 3:49pm Jerry Albright (((((golf clap for Julia)))))) 3:49pm Rayanne yea!! 3:49pm Rayanne clap clap 3:49pm Julia Stone stop, don't, stop, really! :) 3:49pm Rayanne lol 3:49pm Joshua Letourneau Julia, i've been scared my client would hire a candidate i didn't want them to! 3:49pm Rayanne I've had that too 3:49pm Susan Burns Yes, sometimes you must save us from ourselves ;-) 3:49pm Jerry Albright Ready for another quickie topic? 3:49pm Rayanne SOmetimes you send filler candidates because they wat a field of ten... 3:50pm Rayanne yes 3:50pm Julia Stone ready 3:50pm Joshua Letourneau they're great at first . .. and then something is said to worry you . . . 3:50pm Jerry Albright 23. I am not interested AT ALL in being the first recruiter a company agrees to use. 3:50pm Jerry Albright Now way. Never. 3:50pm Jerry Albright Thanks, but no. 3:50pm Eric Gilson Send them my way Jerry 3:50pm Rayanne I agree 3:50pm Joshua Letourneau i like being a human pinata :) 3:50pm Jerry Albright You'll be sorry Eric. 3:50pm Rayanne Theya re not readyy for the process 3:50pm Julia Stone I have never asked that question. and I am so surprised you have 23 of these 3:50pm A Lonnie McRorey Correct 3:51pm Dean Lockett Doesn't tell me they are used to paying fees 3:51pm Eric Gilson you are assuming that the HM has no expoerience dealing with TPR? 3:51pm Jerry Albright Each candidate you send has to be so far above the rest - you'll never get there. 3:51pm Jerry Albright End. Of. Story. 3:51pm Julia Stone ooh, I have one too, do you mind? 3:51pm Rayanne no the company has no exp and cannot possibly understand all that is involved - response time, fees 3:51pm Rayanne etc. 3:51pm Jerry Albright Get your own show Julia........ 3:52pm Joshua Letourneau most companies reject a new process . . . even if the old is broken. it's human nature to resist change 3:52pm Eric Gilson It could be a great opportunity to educate your client 3:52pm Rayanne you said a mouthful there 3:52pm Jerry Albright Undoubtedly the "we want to talk about your fee" discussion will come up AFTER you finally find a good person for them also..... 3:52pm Rayanne I don't want to educate, I want to fill and bill 3:52pm Joshua Letourneau that's when you become the human pinata 3:53pm Rayanne undoubtedly, J 3:53pm Eric Gilson I would accept the search, but when we accept a search, we have guidelines that we accpect from the client 3:53pm Rayanne or there is the 3:53pm Jerry Albright I like your enthusiasm Eric. 3:53pm Shannon Myers what if it's a retained search - first time using tpr 3:53pm Eric Gilson You would start a search without nailing down your fee ahead of time??? 3:53pm Julia Stone I have never had someon try to renegotiate a fee on me after a candidate is in the loop, ever 3:53pm Jerry Albright Shannon-Ok then. 3:53pm Rayanne "we spoke to that candidate already..." speech 3:53pm Jerry Albright Julia - you should get out more...... 3:54pm Julia Stone maybe you are right 3:54pm Jerry Albright but I was really just talking about the "first time" fee 3:54pm Jerry Albright that was one of the reasons I'll pass. 3:54pm Julia Stone I will stay away from virgin fees, next? 3:54pm Jerry Albright His resume was on MOnster. 3:54pm Rayanne yep, they don't like paying for anything... 3:54pm Rayanne true 3:54pm Jerry Albright Julia - do you have a topic? 3:54pm Shannon Myers I've done semi-retained with my MD Practices who have never used a TPR, a small consulting fee to go through whole outline with them and then contingency for actual placement 3:54pm Julia Stone why, funny you should ask, jer? 3:55pm Rayanne hmmmm 3:55pm Julia Stone Rule #23.3 I always tell the manager something negative about the candidates when I submit them, but explain why I send them anyway. 3:55pm Joshua Letourneau companies now have researchers identifying candidates we submit - if there is a LI profile, they say they downloaded that candidate already 3:55pm Rayanne wow 3:55pm pam claughton Julia, why do you do that? 3:55pm Susan Burns Shannon - that is a great approach - its a nice way to educate and build a lasting relationship 3:55pm Rayanne that's happened to me so many times, Josh 3:55pm Julia Stone because they are used to us selling people, I try to show them we aer a partner 3:55pm Jerry Albright Julia - do you make something up? 3:55pm Susan Burns Julia- I like that - noone is perfect and it will help set the candidate up for long term success 3:56pm Julia Stone no, I don't 3:56pm Eric Gilson Why do you work with clients that work against you? 3:56pm pam claughton Josh, people are claiming profile on LinkedIn as a 'candidate' that's absurd. 3:56pm Rayanne that would be unethical 3:56pm Gregg Alper josh, thats the problem with working on spots where the candidates are all over the web 3:56pm Rayanne the whole, lying thing... 3:56pm A Lonnie McRorey Josh i can second that 3:56pm Joshua Letourneau pam, that's why blind resumes are a big-time no-no nowadays 3:56pm pam claughton I wouldn't work with a client that did that. Everyone is on LinkedIn these days, doesn't mean they are a candidate. That shows they don't respect the recruiter. 3:57pm Jerry Albright Or just cover it during the standard "step 6 - cover "shock" factors/negatives" which clearly follows step 5 - schedule the send-out.... 3:57pm Susan Burns Josh - I would ask for a date. And, it applies only if the candidate was in their system prior to the search 3:57pm Jerry Albright Susan - any company doing that is playing games. 3:57pm Gregg Alper pam, that is the biggest problem with tech recruiting 3:57pm Eric Gilson I would find a new client 3:57pm A Lonnie McRorey Had Client say that they saw candidate on Facebook 3:57pm Joshua Letourneau many firms market blind resumes to get a shot to work an assignment . .. but then the blind resume is identified by the researcher :) 3:57pm Susan Burns Doing what Jerry? 3:57pm Rayanne If you maintain an active database..., they will always be in your system.. 3:57pm pam claughton I have an issue with candidate being in their system too...if htey haven't called the candidate, how do they really consdier it theirs? 3:57pm Joshua Letourneau so blind-resume senders/marketers are killin us! :) 3:57pm Eric Gilson It's clients like that who think all TPR suck 3:57pm Rayanne Your client may keep a DB also 3:57pm Jerry Albright Finding your candidate names on the internet. 3:58pm Julia Stone they also will sign up lots of agencies (some clients) just to get you to agree not to steal from them, with no intentions of working with you 3:58pm Eric Gilson they think that because the good TPR fire them 3:58pm Susan Burns Agree Jerry. It must be in their proprietary system. Still questionable but I've seen it clearly written into agreements 3:58pm Susan Burns And, LI netowrk is not a proprietary system! 3:58pm Joshua Letourneau julia, yep - so the non-poaching clause should be limited to only if you make a placement (and then 6 mths, at that) 3:58pm Rayanne that floods he market and sometimes the "rockstar" has been approached a number of times already 3:59pm Susan Burns Jerry - this has been a fabulous CHAT. Is there anything you would like to add in the final few minutes? 3:59pm Dean Lockett Nice chat evry1, 42 participants..sweet ;-) 3:59pm Rayanne woo-hoo 3:59pm Eric Gilson sorry I was late 3:59pm Rayanne active today 3:59pm Julia Stone most of my agreements say they are only in place as long as the agreement is in effect 3:59pm Rayanne me too 3:59pm pam claughton Some of my clients will still credit me for a placement if I submit them a candidate that is in their system previously, because they didn't think of them...the old but/for standard. 3:59pm Julia Stone me too, pam 3:59pm Susan Burns I think this is a new record! Many new names too! 3:59pm Julia Stone great talk, Jerry. you inspire me 3:59pm Joshua Letourneau pam, KEEP that client! 3:59pm Rayanne Have a great day, all!!! 3:59pm Susan Burns Its a dicey game Julia. I have mixed feeling about it 3:59pm Jerry Albright Thanks for coming everyone! 4:00pm Julia Stone what game susan? too much flying by you lost me 4:00pm Eric Gilson Thanks Jerry! See you again 4:00pm Jerry Albright I've got 40 more random principals to share next time! 4:00pm pam claughton By all....back to the resumes! Great chat Jerry. :) 4:00pm Eric Gilson May I request a topic for a future chat? 4:00pm Jerry Albright If anyone would like to connect - just send me an email or call me directly. 4:00pm Jerry Albright 888-293-9249 4:00pm Susan Burns Julia - having to write in a deal that says if the candidate is already in the proprietary DB the serach is void of payment. Maybe a negotiated cost but agree - why didn;t the company find them? 4:00pm Jerry Albright I love to talk about recruiting! 4:01pm Maren Hogan Eric, contact Miss Susan Burns, she is the boss of the chat 4:01pm Eric Gilson thanks! 4:01pm Susan Burns Jerry - guessing that we could keep working down your list in next chats? 4:01pm Jerry Albright sure thing Susan. 4:01pm Susan Burns Eric - YES...please send your ideas 4:01pm Susan Burns Thanks Everyone! This has been a fabulous Chat. Thanks to Jerry for hosting such a terrific topic and generating great dialogue! 4:02pm Maren Hogan w00t Jerry! Way to bring it! Nice work. I got whiplash watching this mother move!…; Added by Susan Burns at 10:52am on November 21, 2008