Search Results - pre-paid

Topic: WINNING Entry: Who Is Hiring My Candidate Here?: cial reporting folks. One day the Controller asked me to work with their Audit Department and please help them find some good people to facilitate the change needed in the department. The overall vision was to implement the GE type audit function, that works so well over at GE. I met with the VP of Audit and his HR rep who would be handling all the resumes and interview schedules the beginning of September. I asked when they wanted the new people to start work and was told by the end of the year. I didn’t see any problems on my end so I asked: “When are you available to begin interviewing?” The VP of Audit started turning the pages in his calendar and finally said, "the first week I am available is the middle of April of next year". I told him obviously no one would be starting at the end of this year if he couldn’t interview until next year. The HR rep piped in with ‘you will forward the resumes to me for review before the end of November and the interviews will start with me and if I clear them they can wait to meet John next April’. I said that was not a good idea to try to keep good candidates dangling and in limbo for so long. HR rep came back with, "we don't care – this is how we do it here". Let’s see; sharing the resume by November, an interview with HR rep sometime after and then we wait until April for the candidates to meet the head audit guy. If the Controller hadn’t asked me to help these people, I would be leaving right now. This has disaster written all over it. To be honest though, the initial search did intrigue me. They wanted someone with 10+ years experience, CPA from a top firm, that spoke Mandarin Chinese, plus two other Chinese dialects, and was a “blonde haired, blue eyed, American boy”. No Asian candidates because they often will be more submissive and subservient and this candidate would be going to take over the head finance role in China in two years. Something like finding a needle in a haystack? My kind of search! Well, come November I had found three (still cannot believe I found three) candidates. I shared their resumes with HR rep, after calling her first and leaving a message that they were being sent over. And waited, and waited. No response from HR rep. Called again and again and again. No response. Year end comes and still no response. I try calling the VP of Audit and get no response. I go to the Controller - who I reminded got me in this mess – but he also got no response from either of them. The VP of Audit didn’t report to him, they were colleagues at the company. In the meantime, after the first of the year I ended up placing two of the candidates with other companies, they were not interested in waiting for something that looked like it would never happen – I couldn't blame them. The third candidate was pretty happy in his current position; so was equally happy to wait it out and see what happened. On a sunny Monday in April I finally received a call from the HR rep. She was calling to say they wanted to interview my candidates this Wednesday in Atlanta and that they would arrange for the candidates to fly down on Tuesday night, stay over and meet several audit people on Wednesday and then fly back. I told the HR rep that two of the candidates were no longer interested and had moved on and that I would call the third. I mentioned this late notice of flying out tomorrow and taking time off work this week could be a problem. She replied that we are XX and if anyone wants to work for us they can wait for us and come to us when we call. You can guess how I wanted to respond – I bit my lips until they bled instead of replying. I called the candidate and he was thrilled and said he would make it work. He did and everyone that met him loved him. They wanted to make him an offer but first because he would be coming in at a Director level he would have to interview with the finance heads of three divisions of the company. He met with two car divisions but they couldn’t arrange a meeting with either of the other two car divisions so they had him meet with the non car division. He met with the head finance guy (Fred) who during the interview asked my candidate "why wait two years to go to China. I’ll offer you a position as our head finance guy in China right now and you can go to China your first day of work while we complete all the necessary paperwork." The surprised candidate said “Aaahhhh, Cora recruited me for the audit department, won’t this cause problems?” Fred told him no one pays attention to the audit department and said he would take care of it. So - not knowing any of this - I get a call from the candidate after the interview: Me: How did it go? Him: Pretty well, they offered me a job and I accepted it. Me: The audit guys were there? Him: No, this is with Fred at the division I interviewed with and I’ll be leaving for China in three weeks. Fred says he’ll call you and get everything straight. Me: What about the audit department? Him: He called them while I was there and told them he hired me on the spot and that I'll be leaving for China in three weeks. I could hear that guy I met from audit yelling and swearing through the phone. Me: OMG!!! (To myself) I had to call the VP of Audit and tell him. Of course, he already knew. He yelled (a lot), said I was the worse recruiter he had ever encountered and that he would make sure I never worked at that company again. I tried to apologize and tell him that maybe the process had taken too long and how would I know that one of the divisions would hire the guy. I had to call the HR rep and talk with her – I listened to about 15 minutes of her telling (yelling) me how bad I was and how she didn’t want to use my services in the first place and wanted to use another recruiter that had always come through for her, blah, blah, blah. I again tried to tell her that their process was perhaps the problem and that sending a good candidate to other divisions wasn’t necessarily a good choice. She thought I should have controlled the candidate better. I reminded her that she set up the interviews and I had no idea who the candidate was meeting with. I thought for sure that I had lost my best and largest client forever. What was I going to do? I was in the middle of searching for 5 people for the Controller’s department! I had to call the Controller. He laughed about what happened and said he had already heard about it through the grapevine and that everyone was laughing at the audit department! I was thoroughly depressed until he said, "Don't worry, you'll never have to work with the audit department again, just the rest of the company"! End of story. Aftermath: * Candidate worked for division and in China for over five years. * VP of Audit was wrong; I have worked for company for many years after; but never for the audit department. * VP Audit guy was fired before the yearend because he could never get the new vision off the ground – are we surprised? * HR rep – never heard from again. * Fred, from the division, paid my fee. I also did several more searches for that division. What I learned: * If the search restrictions don't work with the timeline or your marketplace you walk away from the search – no, you run away!! * As recruiters we know after we meet someone - whether it’s a candidate or client - if we want to represent them to the marketplace. Once we make that decision we need to stick to it – it’s the right decision. This is a search I should have walked away from at that first meeting. * If the people involved in the search are not working with you for a successful completion, they are not serious so don't waste your time with them! Moral for company: If you know one of your divisions is looking for a candidate with the same specs as you are; don't send candidate there to interview! FYI: After this incident I considered every division and department at that company as a different entity and if asked to work with any area they had to sign a detailed contract with me that had precise guidelines they had to follow to have me represent them. I had several separate clients from within one large company. …; Added by Cora Mae Lengeman at 1:55pm on November 14, 2011

Comment on: Topic 'Are Entry Level Candidates Killing America?': ster until some sort of major occurrence. Not sure what that would be. I find your statement of settling for pennies to help companies lower costs and expand their profits to get rich interesting. This argument proves my point. Your argument is that the company I work for makes all this money and I am entitled to my fair share. And what is your fair share?? Who decides? Ultimately you because if you feel they are not paying you what you are worth, you go elsewhere. Thus increasing employees costs for another company in the process. Again, not saying right or wrong. I apologize about rehashing a previous point, but your Dell situation proves my point perfectly and I am not certain if you agree or not. I can't tell your stance. Again, this is not about right and wrong. BUT, they did that to cut costs and the highest cost for most (if not all) employers is employee costs (salaries, benefits, etc.). So again, how does it not prove my point? And one more time. I am not saying entitlement is right or wrong. However, our actions have consequences. Because we as Americans are entitled to things, we are going to continually force companies to make decisions that impact expenses. I am not sure you are an accountant, but look at any companies P&L and let me know the percentage of their expenses is due to employees. Therefore it is safe to say that employee costs have a lot to do with companies decisions. Morgan Hoogvelt said: So then what is your solution? Settle for working for pennies to help companies lower their costs and expand their profits so they can make their executives and shareholders rich? Also, with your example of (2) candidates, in all my years and experience in recruiting, I have never seen two exact candidates, with exact skill sets at with salaries so far apart, doesn’t happen. Bottom line for companies or anyone, is you pay for what you get. If you want a Thoroughbred, be prepared to pay for one. But if you are cool with a miniature pony, there are plenty of those around. Dells move to Mexico was to cut massive costs, we are not talking about cutting people’s salaries in the U.S. by a few dollars, they took all their jobs and specific plants to Mexico and are now paying the same factory assemblers there $2/hr, a pure form of exploitation; not to mention no environmental rules and what not. I helped several people who worked at these Dell plants here in the U.S for years and dedicated themselves to Dell then watched their livelihoods vanish so Dell can max profits. You choose to use the word “entitlement” so fine, I am with you – I…we are entitled! Entitle: to give (a person) the right to do or have something; qualify; allow We go to college why? Because society requires it, because those with a degree will out earn the non-degreed, because specific jobs require the skill set a degree allows. So yes, we all build our skill sets, education, attributes, etc to move up in the world, to take on more responsibility, to make more money, etc. If you want to define it as entitlement, do so. If one puts in the hard work, effort and has the skills they deserve to be rewarded accordingly; aren’t you for the placements you make? You post does make some good points, I just think you should have geared this toward a complete different audience - corporate executives, professional athletes, movie/music stars and so forth because they are the ones with the outrageous salaries and crazy demands. That would have been a better target audience instead of the working class of America who is already way behind when all we are doing is trying to get ahead. I respect your opinions, I just don’t and won’t ever agree on this subject. Yes, there are pockets of lazy Americans everywhere, but the majority of us keep this country and economy turning everyday by getting out of bed and working in underpaid jobs consistently looking over our shoulders watching for cuts and layoffs. In the Marine Corps they teach their officers to lead from the front - why don’t you start this process off by taking the lead and drop your current role and take a $8/hr job, perhaps some people will fall in behind you. Or, if you are an agency recruiter, start on a pro-bono basis today so companies don’t have to pay fees and incur costs. Ronald said: Morgan, I am not trying to say that people don't work hard or work for the money they make. However, in my opinion, America has turned into a lazy society. You don't have to agree and I do respect that. I am not saying that entry level candidates can not get the salary they want or ask for. I am not saying that people can't ask for more money when they leave. You half way agreed with my analysis by saying people "should" ask for more money when looking for a new job. Should tells me that you think people are entitled. I am not saying that is right or wrong. I am simply saying that asking for more money eventually drives up salary parity and everyone is getting around that amount. Thus increasing companies largest expense, salary costs. You don't think Dell’s move had anything to do with that? It is our fault my friend. We caused the society in which companies feel that they can cut costs elsewhere, and they can. AND, we let it happen. I am sorry you do not agree and I know there are other factors, but if you break it down, it is our fault. If not, I would be very curious whose fault it is. If you have a business, 2 candidates, same skill set. One costs you $30k, one costs $50k. Which one do you take?? Benefit minus Costs equal value. Unfortunately, the answer use to be we have more talent. We can not use that excuse much longer. I apologize if you found my posting abrasive. I guess at the end of the day, my point is simply we need to get more competitive in America because we are losing our swagger. It kills me because I do love this country. Morgan Hoogvelt said: Upon first reading the couple sentences of this post I thought it was going to be on point, however when I got to the part of the paragraph when you quoted asking salaries - now I can say you are way off point and are focusing on only a micro-view of things. First off, in recruiting we want to get our candidates more money - hell, all job seekers on their own should want more money. Have you not looked around and do you not see that the majority of American workers are underpaid and over worked? And way to blast the American worker as it is our fault our jobs are being outsourced. Did you not put one thought into this whole scenario? People move and leave because there is no job security. Gone are the days where you can put in your time, hard work and loyalty and get repaid in the end with benefits and a retirement paycheck. But a company, such as Dell, will not hesitate to close an entire plant down and ship all jobs to Mexico to save a few pennies on each unit produced. You ever read that case study? As for new grads, our corporate society requires education, everyone wants at least a Bachelors degree in the majority of jobs. Congrats, you have your degree - what's that? You are in the hole $50k which the govt is kind enough to let you pay back over the next 50 years. Oh and by the way, here is your starting salary - $30k. In case you didn't realize this, workers in the 70's were already making $7.50/hr + benefits. Now in those same exact position today, they are making $7.25/hr with no benefits, how the hell does this make sense? And it’s not a sense of entitlement, it’s a sense of putting in the hard work and hours to get educated and to get paid for your work, knowledge and expertise. Probably the same reasons why you are in recruiting, because the money is good. I'd say next time you get an idea to write a post like this, unless you are trying to start controversy, to do your research and make sure you have solid talking points. As a recruiter you should know that even the unemployed people have to maintain a proper resume and career path going forward. It's not that Americans won't stoop to taking a lower job, its that we cannot afford to. …; Added by Ronald at 2:01pm on April 14, 2011

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