Comments - How to NOT Win Friends and Influence People - RecruitingBlogs2024-03-29T10:43:21Zhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profiles/comment/feed?attachedTo=502551%3ABlogPost%3A1487655&xn_auth=noLet's be honest. When you wor…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-31:502551:Comment:14900522011-12-31T10:19:52.314ZBill Wardhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/BillWard92
<p>Let's be honest. When you work with contingency recruiters, you haven't hired anyone. You can cut them lose anytime and not owe them a dime. They work for free until you actually decide to hire one of their candidates. If you expect loyalty from a contingency recruiter, you're barking up the wrong tree. They follow the money. If they can get a higher fee from one of your competitors or another company outside your industry, you're SOL. Your candidate is no longer exclusive...and that's not a…</p>
<p>Let's be honest. When you work with contingency recruiters, you haven't hired anyone. You can cut them lose anytime and not owe them a dime. They work for free until you actually decide to hire one of their candidates. If you expect loyalty from a contingency recruiter, you're barking up the wrong tree. They follow the money. If they can get a higher fee from one of your competitors or another company outside your industry, you're SOL. Your candidate is no longer exclusive...and that's not a pleasant place to be when your hiring manager wants you to make an offer and make it happen.</p>
<p>I'm confused. Help me understand this. If none of the candidates came close as you describe, why would you feel compelled to coach him on how to present subpar candidates to your hiring manager? </p>
<p>I'm also curious why you felt the need to engage an additional, unproven TPR when you supposedly have a tried and true TPR that has proven their ability to not waste your time and deliver solid candidates? If I had that kind of relationship, I would give them first opportunity and not put them in competition with some shady firm throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks. </p> Hi Bill, thanks for commentin…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-28:502551:Comment:14898252011-12-28T18:09:20.608ZAmy Ala Millerhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/AmyAla
<p>Hi Bill, thanks for commenting. I think part of your response was cut off, but I do want to address a couple of points. First of all, I think we (mostly) agree. As far as the hiring manager being a flake - Schultz will probably say I'm the last person to defend hiring managers but in this case the TPR had the exact profile of what we were would looking for and what would be considered a rockstar. None of the candidates he submitted came close. In fact, one candidate we had already…</p>
<p>Hi Bill, thanks for commenting. I think part of your response was cut off, but I do want to address a couple of points. First of all, I think we (mostly) agree. As far as the hiring manager being a flake - Schultz will probably say I'm the last person to defend hiring managers but in this case the TPR had the exact profile of what we were would looking for and what would be considered a rockstar. None of the candidates he submitted came close. In fact, one candidate we had already interviewed in person and rejected. Not sure if he didn't bother to ask her or if she decided not to disclose that information but at any rate someone at some point failed to communicate. I'm sure someone will argue that I should have given him a list of the hundred people we've rejected but the reality is had he done his due diligence he would have known she already interviewed with us.</p>
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<p>I have been completely transparent with the good and the bad of this search and the "story" - I still can't control how he is delivering that message to his recruiters and potential candidates. Unfortunately we learned the hard way that this is not an agency we want to partner with.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>You are correct we have allowed him to submit resumes. I have been delivering timely and constructive feedback throughout the process, even coaching him on how to present the candidates - something his boss should be doing, not his customer. The bottom line is <em>this</em> TPR is indeed a "sales goon" trying to salvage his first ever job order.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Luckily I know the value of a good TPR and we have another agency working on it. These guys are true professionals and we talk a few times a week. They haven't submitted any candidates yet but that's because they're not throwing crap at me and then complaining when I don't like the crap they've shown me. This punk kid could learn a thing or two about recruiting and how to partner with a company. The only mistake I've made in this process is hiring him in the first place.</p> The pressure is intense – the…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-27:502551:Comment:14893752011-12-27T23:30:31.500ZBill Wardhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/BillWard92
<p><b><i>The pressure is intense</i></b> – there will always be pressure to land clients, find candidates, close deals. Sometimes that pressure gets to us. When things don’t go as planned it can cause the most level headed among us to freak out. Jump up and down and swear all you want, but don’t put it in writing to your client.</p>
<p>(The pressure is intense, but handle client related issues professionally without taking it personally. Makes sense.)</p>
<p><b><i>It rarely goes according to…</i></b></p>
<p><b><i>The pressure is intense</i></b> – there will always be pressure to land clients, find candidates, close deals. Sometimes that pressure gets to us. When things don’t go as planned it can cause the most level headed among us to freak out. Jump up and down and swear all you want, but don’t put it in writing to your client.</p>
<p>(The pressure is intense, but handle client related issues professionally without taking it personally. Makes sense.)</p>
<p><b><i>It rarely goes according to plan</i></b> – Listen, you’re dealing with personalities on every side of this business. Why do we act so shocked when something changes? To be more recruiting specific – we tell a hiring manager sure we’ll give it to an agency, fee is 20%. Ok, fine. Then it’s here’s the candidate, salary is $X and fee is $Y THEN the hiring manager isn’t feeling so good about that mythical 20% turning into hard numbers that hit his budget. Unless the candidate is a rockstar, the hiring manager might (prepare yourself) change his mind.</p>
<p>(So in essence, your hiring manager is a flake. He can't seem to get it through his or her head that recruiters actually get paid money. This is where the recruiter and the hiring manager actually have to agree on what a "rockstar" actually looks like in terms of relatable professional accomplishments. This goes a long way in avoiding the dreaded, I'll know it when I see it hiring approach</p>
<p><b><i>Far better to promise little, deliver big</i></b> – Just tell me you’ll work on it, keep me informed on a semi-regular basis, and then quietly slip a superstar under my door. I will jump up and down in a good way. It’s the blowhards that are blathering on about their awesome process and epic connections that look like morons when they send me “ok” candidates. I am not impressed by your office address or who started your firm. I care that you find me what I can’t find myself.</p>
<p>(Results speak louder than words agreed. So how does a recruiting firm that's never worked with you present their capabilities in such as way that will make you want to give them an opportunity to support your hiring initiatives when needed?)</p>
<p><b><i>It’s not the client’s job to make you look good</i></b> – I don’t know how you’ve presented our position or what you’ve told your recruiters and candidates about your relationship with us. I don’t care. So if you’ve sold a bill of goods to someone on your end that you now can’t deliver, that is not my problem. Again, things don’t always go according to plan - and it’s not your client’s job to clean up any mess that these changes may have made for you.</p>
<p>(The contingency hacks you refer to are actually representing your company in the marketplace. You technically hired them. If they shoot their mouths off and look like used car salesman to candidates, that's a direct reflection on your organization as you have authorized these recruiters to work on behalf of you and your organization. Maybe you should care and be accountable for ensuring that the story recruiters are telling potential candidates is compelling and accurate for the sake of everyone involved.)</p>
<p><b><i>You get to choose who you work for</i></b> – 3<sup>rd</sup> party recruiters have this amazing advantage. You actually get to pick the companies you want to do business with. Unless you have a broad national contract or your boss makes you, then yes – you get to decide if you want to put forth any energy on our part. If there is something about me or my company you don’t like, then by all means move along. It’s possible to exit gracefully and save us both the frustration.</p>
<p>(Again, you or your department have allowed this TPR to submit resumes. There has to be some level of commitment in terms of timely, constructive feedback. Your attitude of take or leave it is what's really wrong with the whole internal/external recruiting relationship. You act as though your TPRs are a bunch of sales goons trying to use any tacti</p> Thank you Bill,it's those zeb…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-23:502551:Comment:14885332011-12-23T19:11:03.212ZSandra McCartthttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/SandraMcCartt
<p>Thank you Bill,it's those zebras that complicate things. </p>
<p>somebody asked me what i thought was the one most important thing to be a good recruiter. My take is "a good memory". The fact that you never forget a thing reinforces that i am right. I hope this youngster that Amy is trying to educate with this post will remember his first job rec that went down the tubes and learn something from it. I'd like to jerk this one up and get him off the road to perdition. It concerns me that…</p>
<p>Thank you Bill,it's those zebras that complicate things. </p>
<p>somebody asked me what i thought was the one most important thing to be a good recruiter. My take is "a good memory". The fact that you never forget a thing reinforces that i am right. I hope this youngster that Amy is trying to educate with this post will remember his first job rec that went down the tubes and learn something from it. I'd like to jerk this one up and get him off the road to perdition. It concerns me that i see and hear more of our younger recruiters demanding "respect" rather than earning it</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Trust me when i tellyou that having already lived a long life there is certainly some low hanging fruit. :)</p>
<p> </p>
<p>A warm and safe holiday to all. Denver looks like a Chistmas Card today. One more trip to the airport and our whole group is in. I managed to have to go through a full body pat down due to a Christmas bow in my hair. They did laugh when i said don't worry about it this is the most action i have had in several years. Life is too short not to laugh at ourselves. I sat next to a young airman on his way home to see his kids for Christmas from his airbase in New Mexico. He hauled my carryon as well as a huge shopping bag full of hats off the plane and all the way to luggage pickup. I handed him a hundred and said ,"Tell your kids Santa appreciates your service to our country." Don't forget these kids that are out there away from their families wearing the uniform for not much money , it's tough duty.</p> Sandra- you are a gentle woma…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-23:502551:Comment:14880772011-12-23T02:24:13.816ZBill Schultzhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/BillSchultz
<p>Sandra- you are a gentle woman and a scholar. And a fine example for the recruiter of today and tomorrow. </p>
<p>Happy Holidays to you and your family and to the horses, dogs, cats and zebras. </p>
<p>May you live a long, fruitful life.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Sandra- you are a gentle woman and a scholar. And a fine example for the recruiter of today and tomorrow. </p>
<p>Happy Holidays to you and your family and to the horses, dogs, cats and zebras. </p>
<p>May you live a long, fruitful life.</p>
<p></p> @Bill that made me laugh outl…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-22:502551:Comment:14880702011-12-22T22:17:12.561ZSandra McCartthttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/SandraMcCartt
<p>@Bill that made me laugh outloud. FYI you old whore. You and i sponsored two kids in the "Shop with a Cop" Christmas program. The Deputies take a kid who comes from a single parent struggling home shopping. They get to spend 200.00 dollars each to buy gifts for their brothers and sisters, mom and other family members like grandma who live in their home with 100 of it. They use the other hundred to buy something they want. They did about 40 kids this year. It was interesting that many…</p>
<p>@Bill that made me laugh outloud. FYI you old whore. You and i sponsored two kids in the "Shop with a Cop" Christmas program. The Deputies take a kid who comes from a single parent struggling home shopping. They get to spend 200.00 dollars each to buy gifts for their brothers and sisters, mom and other family members like grandma who live in their home with 100 of it. They use the other hundred to buy something they want. They did about 40 kids this year. It was interesting that many of them wanted a coat and shoes first then spent the rest of theirs on a toy of some kind. One of our kids that we sponsored said he wanted a hoodie and tennis shoes. When that was done he said he really didn't need a toy but his little sister needed a coat and shoes as well as toys so he spent the rest that was for him on the coat and shoes for sister. The deputy who was with him was so touched by it he called me to tell me what a neat kid this was. Guess who the hell bought those kids about 10 toys that the deputy told him came from Santa. You and i did bubba. And an outdated computer has been refurbed by my geek, loaded with computer games and delivered to their mom for Christmas morning.</p>
<p>Kids, animals and old people . I got a note from one of the animal groups i work with. They did a helping Srs with shots and food for their pets. My note said, can you help Emily age 66 with shots and food for her cat. I sent my pal back a note and said" Sure, do you think anybody would take on Sandra age 70 with 7 horses, 4 dogs and 6 cats." She wrote back and siad, "I don't think i would ask, somebody might come get you as one of those dotty old women with too many animals." </p>
<p>I know when i have been one upped and when to shut up. Sometimes it's fun to be "Geezer Bait".</p> I'll vote for anyone who send…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-22:502551:Comment:14883252011-12-22T21:11:03.000ZBill Schultzhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/BillSchultz
<p>I'll vote for anyone who sends me $105</p>
<p>I'll vote for anyone who sends me $105</p> Darryl Dioso, Fourth Party Re…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-22:502551:Comment:14883172011-12-22T20:09:11.469ZDarryl Diosohttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/DarrylDioso
<p>Darryl Dioso, Fourth Party Recruiter, Social Media Recruitment <span style="text-decoration: line-through;">Expert</span> Dabbler, Cold Caller (with manners), Completely Transparent, Agile, Iterative, <span style="text-decoration: line-through;">Team Player</span> Collaborative and waiting to Occupy the washroom. </p>
<p>How's that for 2012?</p>
<p>Darryl Dioso, Fourth Party Recruiter, Social Media Recruitment <span style="text-decoration: line-through;">Expert</span> Dabbler, Cold Caller (with manners), Completely Transparent, Agile, Iterative, <span style="text-decoration: line-through;">Team Player</span> Collaborative and waiting to Occupy the washroom. </p>
<p>How's that for 2012?</p> Believe me anybody who elects…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-22:502551:Comment:14880562011-12-22T19:25:59.284ZSandra McCartthttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/SandraMcCartt
<p>Believe me anybody who elects me to anything gets what they damn well deserve. VP's get to do all the work and Shultz would have a full time job. You have my permission to publish the response i wrote and sent you. I think it might be helpful to actually publish his emails without name and company name. Let experience people comment then send him a link to this post. Instant training that he doesn't have the time or money to get in his lifetime.</p>
<p>Believe me anybody who elects me to anything gets what they damn well deserve. VP's get to do all the work and Shultz would have a full time job. You have my permission to publish the response i wrote and sent you. I think it might be helpful to actually publish his emails without name and company name. Let experience people comment then send him a link to this post. Instant training that he doesn't have the time or money to get in his lifetime.</p> If you do post the entire thi…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2011-12-22:502551:Comment:14880552011-12-22T19:21:32.116ZSandra McCartthttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/SandraMcCartt
<p>If you do post the entire thing , post the second one he sent also. I am embarassed for this kid. If he worked for me i would jerk him up and ground him from the computer for a month or tell him that there is not much room for whiney babies or demanding little green narcissists in our industry.</p>
<p>If you do post the entire thing , post the second one he sent also. I am embarassed for this kid. If he worked for me i would jerk him up and ground him from the computer for a month or tell him that there is not much room for whiney babies or demanding little green narcissists in our industry.</p>