Comments - Why Paying Employees More Is A Great Way To Save Money - RecruitingBlogs2024-03-28T10:01:48Zhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profiles/comment/feed?attachedTo=502551%3ABlogPost%3A1805779&xn_auth=no@ Sandra: I'm not going there…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-30:502551:Comment:18076762014-05-30T01:16:57.156ZKeith D. Halperinhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/KeithDHalperin
<p>@ Sandra: I'm not going there, Sandra.</p>
<p>I will say that it's harder to move up here than it is in most advanced countries.</p>
<p>Also, what about the kids? There are a LOT of kids growing up in poverty.</p>
<p></p>
<p>@ Adam: by extension, we're talking about a "living wage" and how best to achieve that. I believe that increasing the minimum wage helps with that.</p>
<p>-kh</p>
<p></p>
<p>@ Sandra: I'm not going there, Sandra.</p>
<p>I will say that it's harder to move up here than it is in most advanced countries.</p>
<p>Also, what about the kids? There are a LOT of kids growing up in poverty.</p>
<p></p>
<p>@ Adam: by extension, we're talking about a "living wage" and how best to achieve that. I believe that increasing the minimum wage helps with that.</p>
<p>-kh</p>
<p></p> Just curious but why are you…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-28:502551:Comment:18072282014-05-28T13:51:56.081ZAdam Kruegerhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/AdamKrueger
<p>Just curious but why are you all talking about minimum wage? Mr. Petrone didn't mention 'minimum wage' once in his post and if my reading comprehension is as good as I think it is, his post wasn't really addressing the issue of minimum wage at all, but rather attempting to tackle the issue of turnover and worker productivity from a compensation stand-point. I agree that 'minimum wage' as a topic isn't very far away from this one, but I highly doubt that the author's intent was to start a…</p>
<p>Just curious but why are you all talking about minimum wage? Mr. Petrone didn't mention 'minimum wage' once in his post and if my reading comprehension is as good as I think it is, his post wasn't really addressing the issue of minimum wage at all, but rather attempting to tackle the issue of turnover and worker productivity from a compensation stand-point. I agree that 'minimum wage' as a topic isn't very far away from this one, but I highly doubt that the author's intent was to start a discussion about minimum wage.</p> Keith, if you want to ignore…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-28:502551:Comment:18071242014-05-28T02:29:16.741ZSandra McCartthttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/SandraMcCartt
Keith, if you want to ignore uneducated young women having kids they can't support with two or three baby daddies who contribute nothing or minimal support you are ignoring one of the root causes of poverty.<br />
<br />
If we pay people more for not being able to do anything but show up half the time because they had no interest in anything but hanging out and making babies we haven't done one damn thing about the root cause of poverty..lack of education or training to do anything. If we pay more money…
Keith, if you want to ignore uneducated young women having kids they can't support with two or three baby daddies who contribute nothing or minimal support you are ignoring one of the root causes of poverty.<br />
<br />
If we pay people more for not being able to do anything but show up half the time because they had no interest in anything but hanging out and making babies we haven't done one damn thing about the root cause of poverty..lack of education or training to do anything. If we pay more money for not being able to do anything it is simply an extension of welfare. There are too many people who have come from grinding poverty to a comfortable middle class because they worked like dogs to learn to something rather than protest. Keith,
I just reread my answe…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-27:502551:Comment:18070252014-05-27T21:15:03.462ZDavid Wellshttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/DavidWells
<p>Keith,</p>
<p>I just reread my answer and I realized the tone sounds kind of cranky. Sorry about that I did not edit before I posted and was already putting out fires this morning. </p>
<p>Keith,</p>
<p>I just reread my answer and I realized the tone sounds kind of cranky. Sorry about that I did not edit before I posted and was already putting out fires this morning. </p> Keith,
Let me address a coup…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-27:502551:Comment:18068962014-05-27T17:37:02.969ZDavid Wellshttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/DavidWells
<p>Keith,</p>
<p> Let me address a couple of main points and then get into a more detailed response.</p>
<p> First I would be wary of using the study in your Washington post article. The study they cite was conducted by Arin Dube relying HEAVILY on research done by Card and Krueger. The study conducted by Card and Krueger is one of the most highly debunked studies in macroeconomics as their methodology was terribly flawed. </p>
<p> Second you highlight a study from CATO. CATO is not right…</p>
<p>Keith,</p>
<p> Let me address a couple of main points and then get into a more detailed response.</p>
<p> First I would be wary of using the study in your Washington post article. The study they cite was conducted by Arin Dube relying HEAVILY on research done by Card and Krueger. The study conducted by Card and Krueger is one of the most highly debunked studies in macroeconomics as their methodology was terribly flawed. </p>
<p> Second you highlight a study from CATO. CATO is not right wing, I suggest you look at their studies related to military spending, drug wars, incarceration etc. They are libertarian and have fundamental differences from conservative politics on numerous issues. If you are going to see they are “right wing” and then quote a study from Berkeley, one of the most rabidly leftist institutions on the planet, it makes me second guess your ability to see through biases.</p>
<p> To answer your inquiries;</p>
<p> First understand where minimum wage started. Have you ever read the FLSA and its surrounding documentation? The FLSA was never designed to provide a completely livable wage. Check out the following study that provides the back-up documentation to the FLSA and gives numbers relating who earns minimum wage.</p>
<p> <a href="http://americanactionforum.org/research/primer-minimum-wage-and-combating-poverty">http://americanactionforum.org/research/primer-minimum-wage-and-combating-poverty</a></p>
<p> Detailed break out of who earns minimum wage:</p>
<p> <a href="http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/07/19/who-makes-minimum-wage/">http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/07/19/who-makes-minimum-wage/</a></p>
<p> Its heritage so you probably wont like it but highlights of households with minimum wage earners.</p>
<p> <a href="http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2013/02/who-earns-the-minimum-wage-suburban-teenagers-not-single-parents">http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2013/02/who-earns-the-minimum-wage-suburban-teenagers-not-single-parents</a></p>
<p> Chart highlighting the PURCHASING POWER of minimum wage. As you will see the $7.25 in today's dollars actually puts it at the mid range of the wages purchasing power lower that it was in the 70’s but higher than it was in the 30’s when enacted. The purchasing power of the wages are often overlooked but critically important.</p>
<p> <a href="http://economy.money.cnn.com/2013/02/14/minimum-wage-history/">http://economy.money.cnn.com/2013/02/14/minimum-wage-history/</a></p>
<p> Please note that the CBO and other economists note that raising minimum wage will wipe out some jobs. You may be willing to take that trade off but it is important to at least acknowledge that arbitrarily pricing labor above productivity does reduce jobs.</p>
<p> </p>
<p><a href="http://www.humanevents.com/2014/02/18/cbo-minimum-wage-increase-will-wipe-out-500000-jobs/">http://www.humanevents.com/2014/02/18/cbo-minimum-wage-increase-will-wipe-out-500000-jobs/</a></p>
<p> <a href="http://americanactionforum.org/research/how-minimum-wage-increased-unemployment-and-reduced-job-creation-in-2013">http://americanactionforum.org/research/how-minimum-wage-increased-unemployment-and-reduced-job-creation-in-2013</a></p>
<p>Finally a number of people like to cite that labor productivity has increased so much minimum wages should have risen to mirror the rise in productivity. However if you look into BLS data (and I am sorry but I cannot find the chart right now) you would notice that labor productivity has shot up for manufacturing and service employees, as has wages, but retail and restaurant labor productivity has remained stagnant, so wages have done the same thing.</p>
<p> Minimum wage is a hotly contested point but just think about it my original point. Increasing costs lowers demand. Why does anyone think wages are different? Moreover as you have seen increased regulatory costs burden most businesses the total cost per hire has continued to pile on. When that happens companies move more towards automation and less towards manual labor, are you surprised that as the government has continued to grow and interfere in the labor markets you have seen a move towards greater automation and reduction in labor? </p>
<p></p> @ Sandra: It's clear to me th…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-26:502551:Comment:18068432014-05-26T15:44:59.252ZKeith Halperinhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/KeithHalperin
<p>@ Sandra: It's clear to me that when you start talking "baby daddies" etc. we'll have very little point in continuing to talk about this, beyond agreeing that a big *public works project hiring millions of willing and hardworking people would help America.</p>
<p>-kh</p>
<p></p>
<p>*These programs didn't just train people- they HIRED them at a decent wage for the time. (…</p>
<p>@ Sandra: It's clear to me that when you start talking "baby daddies" etc. we'll have very little point in continuing to talk about this, beyond agreeing that a big *public works project hiring millions of willing and hardworking people would help America.</p>
<p>-kh</p>
<p></p>
<p>*These programs didn't just train people- they HIRED them at a decent wage for the time. (<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Works_Progress_Administration" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Works_Progress_Administration</a>) "At its peak in 1938, it provided paid jobs for three million unemployed men and women, as well as youth in a separate division, the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Youth_Administration" title="National Youth Administration">National Youth Administration</a>. Headed by <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Hopkins" title="Harry Hopkins">Harry Hopkins</a>, the WPA provided jobs and income to the unemployed during the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Depression_in_the_United_States" title="Great Depression in the United States">Great Depression in the United States</a>. Between 1935 and 1943, the WPA provided almost eight million jobs.<sup id="cite_ref-3" class="reference"><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Works_Progress_Administration#cite_note-3"><span>[</span>3<span>]</span></a></sup> Full employment, which was reached in 1942 and emerged as a long-term national goal around 1944, was not the WPA goal. It tried to provide one paid job for all families in which the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breadwinner_model" title="Breadwinner model">breadwinner</a> suffered long-term unemployment.<sup id="cite_ref-4" class="reference"><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Works_Progress_Administration#cite_note-4"><span>[</span>4<span>]</span></a></sup> Robert D. Leighninger asserts that “The stated goal of public building programs was to end the depression or, at least, alleviate its worst effects. Millions of people needed subsistence incomes. Work relief was preferred over public assistance (the dole) because it maintained self-respect, reinforced the work ethic, and kept skills sharp."<sup id="cite_ref-5" class="reference"><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Works_Progress_Administration#cite_note-5"><span>[</span>5<span>]</span></a></sup>"</p> And don't forget that when wa…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-25:502551:Comment:18068282014-05-25T17:17:48.817ZSandra McCartthttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/SandraMcCartt
And don't forget that when wages go up so does the cost of goods and services. It won't bother me much if the cost of a happy meal goes up two dollars but I suspect it will bother the single mom trying to feed three kids if it costs six dollars more after she got a three dollar an hour raise. Inflation hits the poor worse than the middle class.
And don't forget that when wages go up so does the cost of goods and services. It won't bother me much if the cost of a happy meal goes up two dollars but I suspect it will bother the single mom trying to feed three kids if it costs six dollars more after she got a three dollar an hour raise. Inflation hits the poor worse than the middle class. Noble thought Keith, but cons…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-25:502551:Comment:18068232014-05-25T17:04:11.581ZSandra McCartthttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/SandraMcCartt
Noble thought Keith, but consider this. All theses people you are talking about trying to support a family or CHILDREN on minimum wage are not. They qualify for and receive in most cases, gov. Assistance in terms of food stamps, wic, chip (healthcare for children), housing assistance, in some cases utility assistance. This is based on their income.<br />
<br />
Take food stamps alone. At min. Wage they receive aprox 400.00 a month in food stamps. At 10.10 an hour their food stamp amount is cut to aprox.…
Noble thought Keith, but consider this. All theses people you are talking about trying to support a family or CHILDREN on minimum wage are not. They qualify for and receive in most cases, gov. Assistance in terms of food stamps, wic, chip (healthcare for children), housing assistance, in some cases utility assistance. This is based on their income.<br />
<br />
Take food stamps alone. At min. Wage they receive aprox 400.00 a month in food stamps. At 10.10 an hour their food stamp amount is cut to aprox. 200.00 a month. Housing allowance is cut by aprox. 300.00 a month. They no longer qualify for utility assistance and may not qualify for other assistance. Do the math. The raise of 3.00 an hour ( using round numbers) is 120.00 a week roughly 500. And change. They lose aprox 500. A month and in most cases more in terms of assistance they receive so in many cases they are worse off than they were at min. Wage. I just worked this problem with a young lady who is trying to better herself by getting a better job. Although she would like to be off welfare she turned down a better job because she would lose over 200.00 a month and couldn't make ends meet.<br />
<br />
I think these people protesting are in for a shock if they get what they want. It seems to me to be a somewhat clever way for the gov. To say they have raised the minimum wage and reduced the welfare rolls. The stats will prove that is the case but I think in many cases the people who get that raise are going to wake up still trapped in poverty.<br />
<br />
Unless of course they decide to stay in school, quit having two or three kids with different baby daddies or fathering four or five kids they can't or won't support.<br />
<br />
The only answer I can see now that we have created three generations of welfare receipants is to start gov. Programs where everybody drawing gov. Assistance works in programs where they can receive training in a trade while they are receiving assistance. We did it with the CCC and WTPA after the depression. Got lots of infrastructure built, instilled some knowledge and pride in people because they worked for their money. They learned how to weld, operate heavy equipment, do payroll and keep a set of books then went into the private sector with marketable skills.<br />
<br />
When we start paying people more than what a job is worth they don't learn anything, won't be better off and won't have any more marketable skills. We will however, shift the cost of welfare to the employer who may replace the unskilled worker with technology or be able to hire someone with more education and skill than what they get for min. Wage now. The unintended consequences of paying people based on what it takes them to support a family rather than paying them for what they can do may be shocking to those who need it the most. @ David: Please cite your sou…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-25:502551:Comment:18064862014-05-25T08:35:17.948ZKeith D. Halperinhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/KeithDHalperin
<p>@ David: Please cite your sources. for your claims. Here's my sources.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2012.htm" target="_blank">http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2012.htm</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/07/19/who-makes-minimum-wage/" target="_blank">http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/07/19/who-makes-minimum-wage/</a> It shows that hat the $7.25/hr Federal minimum wage is now about the same (in constant dollars) as it was in 1980.</p>
<p>".…</p>
<p>@ David: Please cite your sources. for your claims. Here's my sources.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2012.htm" target="_blank">http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2012.htm</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/07/19/who-makes-minimum-wage/" target="_blank">http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/07/19/who-makes-minimum-wage/</a> It shows that hat the $7.25/hr Federal minimum wage is now about the same (in constant dollars) as it was in 1980.</p>
<p>". Increasing wages above productivity tend to lead to layoffs and fewer job opportunities."</p>
<p>While you can find studies backed by right wing think tanks like the Cato Foundation (<a href="https://www.google.com/#q=who+earns+minimum+wage+cato" target="_blank">https://www.google.com/#q=who+earns+minimum+wage+cato</a>) and the Heritage Foundation (<a href="http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2013/02/who-earns-the-minimum-wage-suburban-teenagers-not-single-parents" target="_blank">http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2013/02/who-earns-the-minimum-wage-suburban-teenagers-not-single-parents</a>) which back you up (while citing the same BLs stats I did), a study by the University of California (<a href="http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2023116005_wageimpactsxml.html" target="_blank">http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2023116005_wageimpactsxml.html</a>) says you are mistaken.</p>
<p>Furthermore:Many economists agree: Raising the minimum wage reduces poverty (<a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2014/01/04/economists-agree-raising-the-minimum-wage-reduces-poverty/" target="_blank">http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2014/01/04/economists-agree-raising-the-minimum-wage-reduces-poverty/</a>):</p>
<p>Let’s first highlight the major results. Dube (the analyst quoted in the op-ed piece) uses the latest in minimum-wage statistics and finds <strong>a negative relationship</strong> between the minimum wage and poverty. Specifically, raising the minimum wage 10 percent (say from $7.25 to near $8) would reduce the number of people living in poverty 2.4 percent. (For those who thrive on jargon, the minimum wage has an “elasticity” of -0.24 when it comes to poverty reduction.)</p>
<p>Using this as an estimate, raising the minimum wage to $10.10 an hour, as many Democrats are proposing in <strong>2014, would reduce the number of people living in poverty by 4.6 million. It would also boost the incomes of those at the 10th percentile by $1,700. That’s a significant increase in the quality of life for our worst off that doesn’t require the government to tax and spend a single additional dollar.</strong> And, given that this policy is self-enforcing with virtually no administrative costs while challenging the employer’s market power, it is a powerful complement to the rest of the policies the government uses to boost the living standards of the worst off, including the Earned Income Tax Credit, food stamps, Medicaid, etc."</p>
<p>Folks, we're at a fundamental difference in philosophies here: I believe that most people in poverty are trapped and can't get out of poverty "by their own bootstraps", so there needs to a "safety net" to keep people from slipping into destitution, <strong>particularly children</strong>. Some of you believe that most people in poverty are not trapped in poverty and can get out of poverty "by their own bootstraps, so there doesn't need to be a "safety net" to keep people from slipping into destitution, particularly children, or at least it shouldn't be increased.</p>
<p>Some of you may have been poor, and believe that if you could make it out, so can anybody/everybody else. I don't believe that.</p>
<p>Here are some statistics about poverty in the US (<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_the_United_States" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_the_United_States</a>):</p>
<p>-kh</p> it's an interesting social ex…tag:recruitingblogs.com,2014-05-23:502551:Comment:18066032014-05-23T16:07:27.318ZAmy Ala Millerhttps://recruitingblogs.com/profile/AmyAla
<p>it's an interesting social experiment you're proposing, Keith - but I've busted my ass for 15 years to get to where I am with very little support and zero financial support from others. If one has minimal skills and minimal work ethic I should give you a $6 / hr raise why?</p>
<p>I know there are those who genuinely want to improve their situation and who are working their way through school, etc to be able to earn more. Those aren't necessarily the people I see spitting on the street,…</p>
<p>it's an interesting social experiment you're proposing, Keith - but I've busted my ass for 15 years to get to where I am with very little support and zero financial support from others. If one has minimal skills and minimal work ethic I should give you a $6 / hr raise why?</p>
<p>I know there are those who genuinely want to improve their situation and who are working their way through school, etc to be able to earn more. Those aren't necessarily the people I see spitting on the street, screaming and carrying their SEIU sponsored flashy signs.</p>