"dirty rotten job searching tricks"

I prefer not to comment on blogs that are blatant marketing posts on any site, by people who are too damn cheap to buy an ad. Phil Rosenberg makes a career out of posting half a blog with a link to his site to try and drive traffic to his site. I wasn't born at night and it sure wasn't last night. Being called out for moderating comments it appears he has decided to let comments through on this site rather than try to get them posted on his own blog.

A few words to you Phil. If you want to promote your services to candidates as a job search coach. Buy an ad, you cheap bastard.

If you want to post on a site for recruiters hoping that some recruiters might refer someone to you. It might be in your best interest not to post something that by your own headline is a " dirty, rotten, trick".

There are about a million reasons why job seekers should not resort to "dirty rotten tricks", not the least of which is trying to go around someone who can and will represent that job seeker directly to a hiring manager or have the ear of an internal recruiter. Obviously if a company had a problem paying a fee or did not want a recruiter to interview and screen candidates, the company would not have listed the job with a recruiter. I've been around since Lincoln was a cadet and tennis balls were square. I can promise you that advising any job seeker to go around HR, a recruiter, internal or external has resulted in more disappointment or problems for job seekers than any other stupid advice that failed recruiters turned "job each coaches" ever gave anybody.

Here is the call I got last week.

Candidate: I saw an ad a recruiter was running, I figured out who it was, so I sent my resume to the general manager, he sent it to HR, they won't return my calls nor will the GM. Somebody told me they were interviewing with this company through you. Can you get me an interview?

Me: no, sorry, you have already contacted them and have obviously called them until they have eliminated you.

Candidate: why, I have the experience they want?

Me: I don't know, if I had submitted you I could answer that question. I do know that they listed this spot with two recruiters and have asked us to screen, reference check and do indepth interviews because they don't want to do that internally.

Candidate: but why do they not want to save paying a fee?

Me: don't know guy, I guess they are willing to have us qualify candidates. In the future I would suggest that if you see a recruiter running an ad you assume there is a good reason the company is using a recruiter and contact the person who can get you presented and get feedback for you.

For you Phil, maybe your headline should have read, "dirty, rotten, tricks that can result in job seekers shooting themselves in the foot"

Buy an ad you cheap bastard.

Comment by Sandra McCartt on June 13, 2012 at 5:21pm: And dear job seeker, if you think for one minute that you can get more money if a company doesn't pay a fee some idiot job coach has blown more smoke than one would find at a tribal pow wow. Salary ranges are set based on the salary guidelines for a position or department. A recruiting fee is a one time expense deductible for an employer as a professional fee. Payroll is ongoing *hopefully*. How do i know this for sure. I have offered to cut a fee for an employer if they would bump the starting salary for my candidate when we were not very far apart. The answer, "we are at the top of what we can offer, the fee is not considered a payroll expense. Fees are budgeted as an expense item.". "We do not settle a legal claim for more money if we don't use an attorney and we don't pay a candidate more if we don't use a recruiter."

Any job search coach who tells you that you can get more money if the company doesn't have to pay a fee is trying to convince you that by paying him you can get more money. Nobody is that dumb. That is why recruiters do not charge candidates to represent them. Any company who would list with a recruiter then tell a candidate they could pay more if they didn't have to pay the fee is not one most folks would want to work for...think about it.

Comment by Kelly Blokdijk on June 13, 2012 at 9:33pm: T H A N K - Y O U ! Sandra!!!

I was included in those not deemed worthy of having my comments "approved" on the moderated post you are referring to...

All I said was "what so "tricky" about using a Google search?" And, maybe the person who initially posted "dislike" was stating their dislike for YET ANOTHER FLIPPING infomercial.

I really pity the job seekers that allow themselves to be influenced by sheeeet peddlers trying to pass themselves off as altruistic servants of the world, while generating income off the least fortunate lost souls. Enough with the crappy, generic, superficial advice passed off as a magical solution but almost always does more harm than good. Please make it stop!!!

I've had several conversations this week already trying to correct the wrongness of all this insanity. So many confused people are getting their panties in a bunch when they follow advice of idiots and then they don't understand why it isn't "working" like promised.

Again, RBC needs to have a mechanism to keep the focus on what the site claims is the focus here... I get so frustrated when I click on an article that full of useless nonsense time after time.

Just recently, I saw a whole slew of "talent crisis" and "war for talent" topics posted here. Haven't we seen enough regurgitated content with those titles over the past decade or two? Pathetic! It's such a common theme, that Google auto completes if you type the first few letters of those terms. Noteworthy, newsworthy, fresh article idea? HECK NO!!!

That's my PC version of this rant...

Comment by Sandra McCartt on June 13, 2012 at 10:23pm: Kelly kalls it again. Another flipping infomercial. What amazes me is that folks (ok animal it may be cornball but it's better than peeps or pple.) keep writing this same old tired stuff because they read other articles or make about 40 cold calls and get their ass handed to them so suddenly they are on the band wagon for the "war for talent". Flash kiddies, it's always been that way.

There is always some jerkweed trying to peddle telling somebody else what to do. It's been that way since Bernard Haldane came up with the idea of charging an arm and leg for a disk full of company names. It got so bad that Bernard himself denounced what that high dollar scam had become. Course he had already cashed in from selling franchises.

Anybody have any question that moderating your comments results in people who never forget that you are being a controlling ass. Some old gal will always come along and decide enough of your garbage is enough and open a platform you can't control.

anybody want some good advice about how to find a job. Ask a recruiter, we will tell you for free and believe it or not we talk to employers every day and know where and how they are finding people. Why pay to have yourself rescrewed. If somebody is so wonderful why would they have to write goofy informercials to get their name out there instead of buying an ad and acting like a business instead of being a cheap bastard.

Comment by Aurelio Sisto on June 14, 2012 at 7:48am: If I could hit *like* a second time, I would ;)

Comment by Jackie Burress on June 14, 2012 at 9:29am: Of course this whole post is great, but one of my favorite lines: "I've been around since Lincoln was a cadet and tennis balls were square." :)

Comment by Sandra McCartt on June 14, 2012 at 10:22am: @aurelio repeat after me, like, like ,like I like this post because I am so sick of advertorials I would like to rock these people to sleep..with a whole pile of little bitty rocks. :)

@jackie, I guess I could have claimed to be a founding member of AARP. Somebody accused me of being a dinosaur, no darlin, not a dinosaur but I did have one as a pet but it got too difficult to walk him in four inch heels.

Comment by Bill Schultz on June 14, 2012 at 12:47pm: Well I feel honored that Phil let me post.. Until my last post that debunked all of his argument. That one saldly didn't make the cut. Seems Rosenberg is a censoring wimp.

Comment by Sandra McCartt on June 14, 2012 at 1:24pm: It's ok doll, you can post on my thread any time. Please reporst your debunk here. What do you expect from a cheap bastard who ignores the request of a site that he not post advertorials. Most wimps have a streak of bully in them. The internet is the only place they can get away with it by moderating posts and abusing the requests of sites that members not use the site as a marketing and promotional garbage dump.

I thought of a funny deal i had happen several months ago where a candidate went around me. I was working on an HR spot with the VP of HR believe it or not. Candidate sent his resume in. His claim to fame in the HR world was that he had owned a couple of bars and had done all the harin and farin and all the reporting. I had a long discusson with him as to that was not the background required in this position so i would not submit him. It didn't take him long to figure out where the position was, he applied on his own, used some internal people he knew to get an interview. Sent me a rather gloating email that he was interviewing with this company. Great, not through me thank God. I filled the spot a week later didn't think much about it.

A few days later i got an email from this guy telling me that he had the interview with the company, really thought he could do the job but HR had told him exactly what i had told him and ended the interview by telling him that they would suggest he contact me, perhaps i could assist him to find something that was a better fit for him.

Does anybody think i would contact him about anything after that little end run. I told him i thought he was doing a great job all by himself he didn't need me. He wanted to come in and talk to me about helping him. My final offering to him was, "John the biggest problem i think you are going to have is that you don't understand that no, means no and you have a little problem being able to understand that just because you think you are qualified it does not make you qualified."

One reason companies use recruiters is that candidates see one line in a job description and ignore all the rest of it or they literally do not understand what the requirements mean. That one line means to them they are qualified. I have had candidates turned down because they were told to contact HR, instead they went around HR and called somebody else. The hiring manager said, "I am turning ole Bob down because i told him to contact HR, he called me instead."" I need to know that my team will follow directions not decide to do the opposite of what they are told."

The stories can go on and on about candidates being submitted through a recruiter who blow themselves out of the tub by trying to connect on linkedin or call execs that they don't know personally or even some that they do know trying to go around HR or thinking that somebody is going to put in a good word for them. I have seen it backfire more times than it worked.

Comment by Bill Schultz on June 14, 2012 at 1:59pm: I wish I could recall it, Sandra. Really he has no premise for his claim. He's feeding on the desperate who feel victimized by the business world and he's giving them license- for a fee, of course. One thing was if he had any metrics for candidate success by following his sage stupidity.

Comment by Sandra McCartt on June 14, 2012 at 2:21pm: The way these job coaching career consulting deals work is that people who are desperate to find a job take desperate measures. They get suckered into paying for somebody to tell them to do more of what they are already doing or doing something that they could find out about by doing a google search or talking to any business person. They will eventually get a job through their own efforts when the fit for a job is right but the parasites take the credit for what is going to happen anyway unless a candidate just goes in the closet and sucks their thumb and quits looking.

The escape hatch for the parasites is always, "Well you paid for my advice but you didn't really follow it or you would have found something sooner and of course it won't work in every situation but then nothing ever does." When any of us pay somebody to listen to us, it doesn't matter what they say, we tend to think that it worked because we talked ourselves right to where we needed to be.

When anybody tells anybody to do something dirty and rotten to get what they want we roll over into situation ethics and that has a way of biting people in the butt. A lot of them are notorious for telling people to leave off jobs, leave off dates of education , the desperate do it then get mad as a hornet when they are asked why there resume only reflects half of their career. Job search coach told them it would make them look younger. Unfortunately the job search coach didn't tell them what was going to happen if they walked through the door looking 60 with a resume that looked 40. Tricking people or trying to hardly ever turns out well.